Hi I'm new to this board, to Moogs and to hardware synths so please forgive any obvious questions...
I recieved the Slim Phatty today and have spent the last 6+ hours trying to set it up properly in Ableton Live.
The SP is on an External Instrument in Live inside an instrument rack and is being controlled by an Axiom 25 keyboard (Midi In of SP connected to Midi Out on Axiom with a Midi cable). No USB used on the SP. USB -> PC on the Axiom.
I haven't yet made any internal setup changes to the SP at all.
So it records and plays back notes in Live but nothing else - any filter sweeps etc are not recorded. I tried connecting the midi out of the SP to the Midi In of the Axiom and then the Midi In of the soundcard but I couldn't get that to work.
So my questions are:
1. How can Live record the parameter changes from the SP as Midi?
2. Have I got Midi set up in the right/best way? For example I have both a Midi in and out on my soundcard (Saffire LE) that aren't being used. Would it be better to connect everything through that?
3. Do I need to make any changes to the settings within the SP?
Many thanks in advance for any help!
Best Setup for Slim Phatty in Ableton?
Re: Best Setup for Slim Phatty in Ableton?
Since first posting I've been trying out loads of different options with some success...
Now Ableton Live records both midi notes (and any other info) sent from the keyboard and any automation (e.g. filter sweeps) from the SP!
This may seem obvious to some but I had a right struggle getting it working. The SP is connected to the keyboard via midi cable and both the keyboard and the SP are connected to the PC via USB.
The way I finally got it to work was to record the midi information from each bit of equipment on separate midi channels.
So both channels in Live have an external instrument set up pointing to the SP but one is USB AUDIO DEVICE and the other is USB AUDIO DEVICE (2).
There might well be a better, more economical way to do this (all on one channel?) but this is the best I've got it so far. Also not sure why there's 2 instances of the USB AUDIO DEVICE (one from USB, one from MIDI?). Like I said before I'm completely new to this and just groping around in the dark until something works.
The last thing that would be good to sort out is recording changes made to the preset sound within the SP - nothing is recorded in the midi clip when the preset is changed whilst the sound is being played. There must be a way to do this though because the midi light comes on in the top right corner of Live when a new sound is selected on the SP.
So if anyone can help with that, or with the whole setup to make it more efficient please let me know! I'll also post back any progress I make.
Now Ableton Live records both midi notes (and any other info) sent from the keyboard and any automation (e.g. filter sweeps) from the SP!
This may seem obvious to some but I had a right struggle getting it working. The SP is connected to the keyboard via midi cable and both the keyboard and the SP are connected to the PC via USB.
The way I finally got it to work was to record the midi information from each bit of equipment on separate midi channels.
So both channels in Live have an external instrument set up pointing to the SP but one is USB AUDIO DEVICE and the other is USB AUDIO DEVICE (2).
There might well be a better, more economical way to do this (all on one channel?) but this is the best I've got it so far. Also not sure why there's 2 instances of the USB AUDIO DEVICE (one from USB, one from MIDI?). Like I said before I'm completely new to this and just groping around in the dark until something works.
The last thing that would be good to sort out is recording changes made to the preset sound within the SP - nothing is recorded in the midi clip when the preset is changed whilst the sound is being played. There must be a way to do this though because the midi light comes on in the top right corner of Live when a new sound is selected on the SP.
So if anyone can help with that, or with the whole setup to make it more efficient please let me know! I'll also post back any progress I make.
Re: Best Setup for Slim Phatty in Ableton?
Since first posting I've been trying out loads of different options with some success...
Now Ableton Live records both midi notes (and any other info) sent from the keyboard and any automation (e.g. filter sweeps) from the SP!
This may seem obvious to some but I had a right struggle getting it working. The SP is connected to the keyboard via midi cable and both the keyboard and the SP are connected to the PC via USB.
The way I finally got it to work was to record the midi information from each bit of equipment on separate midi channels.
So both channels in Live have an external instrument set up pointing to the SP but one is USB AUDIO DEVICE and the other is USB AUDIO DEVICE (2).
There might well be a better, more economical way to do this (all on one channel?) but this is the best I've got it so far. Also not sure why there's 2 instances of the USB AUDIO DEVICE (one from USB, one from MIDI?). Like I said before I'm completely new to this and just groping around in the dark until something works.
The last thing that would be good to sort out is recording changes made to the preset sound within the SP - nothing is recorded in the midi clip when the preset is changed whilst the sound is being played. There must be a way to do this though because the midi light comes on in the top right corner of Live when a new sound is selected on the SP.
So if anyone can help with that, or with the whole setup to make it more efficient please let me know! I'll also post back any progress I make.
Now Ableton Live records both midi notes (and any other info) sent from the keyboard and any automation (e.g. filter sweeps) from the SP!
This may seem obvious to some but I had a right struggle getting it working. The SP is connected to the keyboard via midi cable and both the keyboard and the SP are connected to the PC via USB.
The way I finally got it to work was to record the midi information from each bit of equipment on separate midi channels.
So both channels in Live have an external instrument set up pointing to the SP but one is USB AUDIO DEVICE and the other is USB AUDIO DEVICE (2).
There might well be a better, more economical way to do this (all on one channel?) but this is the best I've got it so far. Also not sure why there's 2 instances of the USB AUDIO DEVICE (one from USB, one from MIDI?). Like I said before I'm completely new to this and just groping around in the dark until something works.
The last thing that would be good to sort out is recording changes made to the preset sound within the SP - nothing is recorded in the midi clip when the preset is changed whilst the sound is being played. There must be a way to do this though because the midi light comes on in the top right corner of Live when a new sound is selected on the SP.
So if anyone can help with that, or with the whole setup to make it more efficient please let me know! I'll also post back any progress I make.
Re: Best Setup for Slim Phatty in Ableton?
I set it up like this using usb for the slim & usb for my midi keyboad:
open a audio track it name it Phatty Audio
open a midi track with the External Instrument on,
set the drop down box to MIDI TO as USB Audio Device (this is my slim phatty yours might be named different) and the next drop down box to ch1
on the midi track the MIDI FROM I left as All ins & All channels
Set Monitor to to Auto
Set Audio to to Phatty Audio (this is the audio track u named before)
On the audio track next set Audio From to Ext. in & 3 (3 is the channel i have the slim phatty audio going in my focusrite pro 24 (sound card) make the channel that the slim is on in your Sound card it muted so you dont get fedback
Set Monitor to In
Set Audio To to Master
I have to set the Track Delay to -35 ms on the Audio TrAck
Have a go of that, thats how i do it
open a audio track it name it Phatty Audio
open a midi track with the External Instrument on,
set the drop down box to MIDI TO as USB Audio Device (this is my slim phatty yours might be named different) and the next drop down box to ch1
on the midi track the MIDI FROM I left as All ins & All channels
Set Monitor to to Auto
Set Audio to to Phatty Audio (this is the audio track u named before)
On the audio track next set Audio From to Ext. in & 3 (3 is the channel i have the slim phatty audio going in my focusrite pro 24 (sound card) make the channel that the slim is on in your Sound card it muted so you dont get fedback
Set Monitor to In
Set Audio To to Master
I have to set the Track Delay to -35 ms on the Audio TrAck
Have a go of that, thats how i do it
Moog Slim phatty, Moog Sub 37, Moog Minataur, Dave Smith Tetra, Win10 64bit, Ableton Live 9.6, Ableton Push, Focusrite Scarlet 6I6, Arturia Beatstep Pro.
Re: Best Setup for Slim Phatty in Ableton?
Thanks for the advice Mesa. With everything set up that way can you record volume changes on the phatty via midi? Or is it possible to control the volume of the phatty via the keyboard or other external controller and record it as midi? This is something I'm still trying to figure out...
Can anyone help with this?
Can anyone help with this?
Re: Best Setup for Slim Phatty in Ableton?
Well it's all getting a bit neater and more efficient here, thanks Mesa, I set it up as you described and it's working good. No need for midi cables at all it seems...
So the last thing to crack was recording automation on the volume control - and after a bit more research I found out there's a midi setting inside the SP called SEND VOL CC7 and this is by default set to off. Once set to ON the volume knob on the SP was picked up by Live and could be assigned to control the volume of the SP channel. In the same menu on the SP it's also necessary to turn LOCAL CONTROL off.
One more thing that was bugging me was muting the track in Live didn't stop the notes - according to Ableton support when an external instrument is being used on a channel muting the channel does not stop the sending of midi data. Here's the explanation from them:
If you have a MIDI track and Mute it, the track is muted and doesn´t output MIDI notes.
If you have an Audio track and Mute it, it mutes the audio output
If you have an MIDI track with an instrument (VSTi, AU, Live device), it mutes the audio output of the instrument (you have also an audio level meter on the track)
If you have an MIDI track with an External Instrument Device, it mutes the returning audio of the External Instrument device but keeps sending MIDI to the External Instrument device.
So the way to mute the track is simply to turn off the external instrument in Live - and this can be assigned to whatever button you choose on a controller.
Anyway it's been pretty hectic sorting all this out, and taken several days, so hopefully this info will be of use to some people who encounter the same problems!
So the last thing to crack was recording automation on the volume control - and after a bit more research I found out there's a midi setting inside the SP called SEND VOL CC7 and this is by default set to off. Once set to ON the volume knob on the SP was picked up by Live and could be assigned to control the volume of the SP channel. In the same menu on the SP it's also necessary to turn LOCAL CONTROL off.
One more thing that was bugging me was muting the track in Live didn't stop the notes - according to Ableton support when an external instrument is being used on a channel muting the channel does not stop the sending of midi data. Here's the explanation from them:
If you have a MIDI track and Mute it, the track is muted and doesn´t output MIDI notes.
If you have an Audio track and Mute it, it mutes the audio output
If you have an MIDI track with an instrument (VSTi, AU, Live device), it mutes the audio output of the instrument (you have also an audio level meter on the track)
If you have an MIDI track with an External Instrument Device, it mutes the returning audio of the External Instrument device but keeps sending MIDI to the External Instrument device.
So the way to mute the track is simply to turn off the external instrument in Live - and this can be assigned to whatever button you choose on a controller.
Anyway it's been pretty hectic sorting all this out, and taken several days, so hopefully this info will be of use to some people who encounter the same problems!
Re: Best Setup for Slim Phatty in Ableton?
Well, I thought I was done but just discovered something else...
The SP will not automatically select the preset that was chosen to record a sound in.
E.g. If I record a sequence on preset no.1, then change the preset to no.2 on the SP and play it back it plays it back on preset 2, not preset 1 which was selected when the recording was made.
Is there a way of recording/changing the preset via midi? The bank/sub bank/program drop downs in the midi clip look like they should do that but they're not at the moment...
Anyone know how to get this working?
The SP will not automatically select the preset that was chosen to record a sound in.
E.g. If I record a sequence on preset no.1, then change the preset to no.2 on the SP and play it back it plays it back on preset 2, not preset 1 which was selected when the recording was made.
Is there a way of recording/changing the preset via midi? The bank/sub bank/program drop downs in the midi clip look like they should do that but they're not at the moment...
Anyone know how to get this working?
Re: Best Setup for Slim Phatty in Ableton?
bank 0, program (#) should do it... select the clip in question and then set this, then play the clip. I'm not set up to test this at the moment but I'm sure it's worked for me in the pastmisiu77 wrote:Well, I thought I was done but just discovered something else...
The SP will not automatically select the preset that was chosen to record a sound in.
E.g. If I record a sequence on preset no.1, then change the preset to no.2 on the SP and play it back it plays it back on preset 2, not preset 1 which was selected when the recording was made.
Is there a way of recording/changing the preset via midi? The bank/sub bank/program drop downs in the midi clip look like they should do that but they're not at the moment...
Anyone know how to get this working?
Re: Best Setup for Slim Phatty in Ableton?
Hi Amos,
Thanks for the reply - I just went to try it out and something far more upsetting happened... there's no sound from the SP at all
((
I've turned it off and on a few times, did factory reset and unplugged it from everything but there's nothing coming out the headphones or the audio out...
What now?!
Thanks for the reply - I just went to try it out and something far more upsetting happened... there's no sound from the SP at all
((I've turned it off and on a few times, did factory reset and unplugged it from everything but there's nothing coming out the headphones or the audio out...
What now?!