filter envelop acting strang ? bug?

[sunny pedaal]

when having a noticable amount of eg amount on the filtercutoff,
and the eg decay set on a , lets say minimum 2-3 sec,
keep the note on ( so no new triggering , and after the decayphase has passed) !
if then, when turning the sustain anticlockwise , and clockwise again , the sustainknob reacts delayed ! that is it takes ( 2-3 sec in this case) to reach the new value you set the sustain to.
( when decaytime is set faster, the sustainknob changes faster etc, it is as if the decay and sustainknobs interact)
it happenes on lots of patches
i have a signature , completely upgraded, with newest software and slewrate mod.
wonder if anybody can reproduce the problem above or has the same experience. ? is it a bug ?

[RL]

when having a noticable amount of eg amount on the filtercutoff,
and the eg decay set on a , lets say minimum 2-3 sec,
keep the note on ( so no new triggering ) !
if then, when turning the sustain anticlockwise , and clockwise again , the sustainknob reacts delayed ! that is it takes ( 2-3 sec in this case) to reach the new value you set the sustain to.
( when decaytime is set faster, the sustainknob changes faster etc)
it happenes on lots of patches
i have a signature , completely upgraded, with newest software and slewrate mod.
wonder if anybody can reproduce the problem above or has the same experience. ? is it a bug ?

Hi,
I guess there's a broken pot in your Voyager.
Rudi

[sunny pedaal]

whenusing decay solo or sustain solo there is no problem
so not a software issue then?
i must say i do believe you gladly, however don't find the logic behind it.
which pot would be broken in this case ?

[RL]

whenusing decay solo or sustain solo there is no problem
so not a software issue then?
i must say i do believe you gladly, however don't find the logic behind it.
which pot would be broken in this case ?

Hmm, I don't understand that. Can you call me? I guess you already got my phone number.
Rudi

[RL]

whenusing decay solo or sustain solo there is no problem
so not a software issue then?
i must say i do believe you gladly, however don't find the logic behind it.
which pot would be broken in this case ?

OK, no phone call
I think the sustain pot or the multiplexer for the sustain pot is broken.
Rudi

[RL]

whenusing decay solo or sustain solo there is no problem
so not a software issue then?
i must say i do believe you gladly, however don't find the logic behind it.
which pot would be broken in this case ?

Hmm, I don't understand that. Can you call me? I guess you already got my phone number.
Rudi

OK, now I know what you were talking about. It's the same thing here on my Voyager. It's not a broken pot or a multiplexer. Let's see ... maybe Amos can explain it.
Have fun,
Rudi

[sunny pedaal]

well, good thing is my voyager is not broken anyway. ( got another confirmation from forum person too)
wonder what it could be , hardware? and if the oldschool also has it , or if it's a processor thing ?
and if it can be fixed afcourse.
now that i know, i will turn down the decay when tuning the sustain, spares me "braincrackingtime".
thanks

[till]

...
the eg decay set on a , lets say minimum 2-3 sec,
keep the note on ( so no new triggering , and after the decayphase has passed) !
if then, when turning the sustain anticlockwise , and clockwise again , the sustainknob reacts delayed ! that is it takes ( 2-3 sec in this case) to reach the new value you set the sustain to.
( when decaytime is set faster, the sustainknob changes faster etc, it is as if the decay and sustainknobs interact)
...

Yes, there is such a coupling going on in many real analog synths.

The decay is a kind of lag processing time constant setting. It "glides" the top envelope peak voltage to the voltage of the sustain. And in your example, it is noticed, because it still is active and tries to smooth out the changed sustain voltages.

Because of this, a spare envelope can be used as lag processor on some synths with voltage controllable sustain level. And the decay knobs sets the slew rate. This trick does also work on many digital Waldorf synths too.

[sunny pedaal]

i don't have that on any other analog monosynth i know.it's not logical to me also, i don't retrigger or so, i don't understand why only the voyager has this to such a obvious degree.

[till]

Its a shame you don't own other Moog classics too.

The Moog Prodigy has the very same thing going on.

So this is NOT Voyager related at all. It is something that origin from the analog design. And there won't be a fix for this, because this would change so many things and would not help many users. Actually, you are the first one I know if complaining about it. So Moog will leave it like it is. You don't change the Porsche engine, just because some does not like it in a certain situation.

[sunny pedaal]

i've owned a prodigy ( sold it because it doesn't have a noise gen), as well as lots of other analog synt's.
so let me say one thing plain:

you're right !
the other synth's do have it too, ( just tested)
don't ask me why but i simply never noticed it so clearly( must be the advantage of the voyagers full tone )
well sorry for the , somehow maybe stupid question ( thought it were like 3 or 4 vca's in a row) and thanks for the expanding knowledge .
sunny

[David Hrivnak]

Your synth is totally fine. I first noticed this same "quirk" with my Macbeth M5N, and I ended up using it to good effect. If you want to do a good, smooth sweep of anything controlled by that envelope, just turn up the decay and sweep the sustain. The decay setting controls how long it takes for the sound to arrive at the sustain's value, so it makes sense that it would effect the time it takes to catch up with a twist of the sustain knob (or a slide of that slider). It's just the way those envelopes work. I thought, because the same thing happens with my Voyager OS (I can't tell you how much I wish they had named it the Model E), that this was normal for all analog synthesizers, but apparently it's different for some.