Tribute = No Second Mod Destination

Jazzpunk · Post by **Jazzpunk** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 7:41 pm

goldphinga wrote:The only reason people are feeling upset is because everyone thought that only the look of the stage was different to the tribute but it makes sense to improve hardware if the opportunity is there. I think the thing to do now would be to offer a free harware upgrade to tribute users with extra features that the stage doesnt have

Couldn't agree more

DeFrag · Post by **DeFrag** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 7:56 pm

...or at the very least, offer us TE owners the upgrade path for a nominal fee if we're willing to do without our units for a few weeks. Moog would have to ramp up a flat surface & pay an extra guy to stand there & support the work though.

hieronymous · Post by **hieronymous** » Sun Feb 25, 2007 1:41 am

Personally, I'm not upset about the Tribute I purchased. I can kind of understand the disappointment, but I don't think that Moog is about the most features for the cheapest price. In a way, by buying the Tribute edition we got to support Moog and be able to participate in something special - not least of which being that it is the last synth designed by Bob Moog.

Personally, I think it's more fun and challenging to work with an instrument's limitations. I know that this is a money thing and that people that paid more seem to be getting "less" but that sounds like bottom-line talk to me, and if Moog were a company where the bottom line was all that mattered, then I don't think we'd be buying their products now - in fact, they most likely wouldn't exist!

I have been lucky enough to own several pieces of Moog gear, both current and vintage, and to have been able to play with a Micromoog - something that playing with the other stuff, including Moogerfoogers, prepared me for. Given that experience, I think the Little Phatty is amazing. There are things that I would change, but it's a great machine with some really cool features that sounds amazing.

PHC · Post by **PHC** » Sun Feb 25, 2007 7:47 am

I believe that this is the fastest growing topic in this forum so far

A week ago I ordered a Tribute, cause I got sick of waiting for the Stage (hey, Moog, you have like 3 more days to start shipping the Stage, cause February is almost over

I'm the wood-panel/blue-led guy so I went for the Tribute (one more week to arrive

I also ordered a CP-251 so I'll have additional mod/tweak fun and I'm not that angry about lacking the second mod destination (I will be if it comes out that you can mod the waveforms separetely, cause that's one thing that I would like LP to have). I don't like digging in the menus so the OS update with S/H and Noise in the menu won't be as fun as turning the CP-251 knobs.

My point of view is that we are getting what we paid for, a limited edition, with wood, serial number, signature, blue-led and stuff that will surely gain value in the future and now we are offered an update for free so we are getting something more then we paid for originally (maybe not the full update - 2nd mod, but a free bonus nonetheless)

In my opinion this discussion should be limited ONLY to the people who bought the Tribute AFTER the features of the Stage were known (cause they had a choice and they thought that TE and SE were going to be the same thing). People who bought the Tribute before, got what they paid for (and now a free bonus) and I bet 90% are happy about what they have, but there will always be bitchers that will say that Moog "ripped the of".

BUT on the other hand it's not very nice of Moog not to clear things out, esspecially multiple questions have been asked (Xenollop - don't worry, we are getting the Tribute soon, yeah

Like hieronymous said: Moog ain't about price/features.

MOOG is about MOOG

Jazzpunk · Post by **Jazzpunk** » Sun Feb 25, 2007 6:13 pm

PHC wrote:Like hieronymous said: Moog ain't about price/features.

Interesting to read the reponses of those who actually prefer a synth with less options...who knew?

Every synth is about the sound and the features. Those features are what shape the sound! I guess I'm just not understanding why someone would actually opt for less sound creation options.

I do agree though that the TE is a damn sexy synth...enjoy!

Xenollop · Post by **Xenollop** » Sun Feb 25, 2007 6:30 pm

I had my TE sent to my parents house as my apartment has a crap way of dealing with packages. They sent me pictures of the TE's box and then took it out and took more pictures...
It was an odd feeling between ransom pictures and drooling at the sight of food.

When the TE came out and I saw it in Future Music I was hungry to get one, but with other expenses let it go.
Once pictures of the Stage came out I went back and forth between the look of the two. I'd read, as did most people, that the update online was the only difference to the insides. But something told me they'd change the inside because it seemed obvious.
Once I started Eyeing the Tribute again, I considered the re-sell value and felt that I should take opportunity of Guitar Center as Sweetwater kept changeing the availability date of the Stage Edition...plus the wood and blue does kickass.

It'll be great if Moog offers a hardware upgrade (if it's free)...but obviously the downside is having to wait to get it back

I just want to play mine...with or without 2nd Mod Destination...whatever the heck that does....hahaha

PHC · Post by **PHC** » Sun Feb 25, 2007 8:05 pm

Interesting to read the reponses of those who actually prefer a synth with less options...who knew?

It's not that I prefer less options. I just don't make it a big deal since I'll have a CP-251 to back me up.

When I was considering buying LP, I also came across Nord Modular G2 synth which would allow me to have all the creation options I would ever need (check out the software editor demo from Clavia's website, it's fun

and I was very close to buying one, but then I thought I want a LP and it was not about all the cool features and stuff. I wanted a Moog and that's it. I don't really care about the 2nd mod, the LP is going to be a lot of fun anyway.

KarnEvil · Post by **KarnEvil** » Mon Feb 26, 2007 5:52 am

Does actually anyone know if this second modbus is fully independent, or just some minor afterthought? It might not be a very big deal afterall.

Anyway, I thinks it's sad (but understandable) that moog gets so much negative feedback for improving an already great synth. It's the same thing with the Voyager. It came out without filtertracking portamento and resonance not fully tracking keyboard, and if moog should decide to make these things standard features - that's just how it should be IMO - improving obvious niggles when needed.
It has never payed off being among the very first to buy a new product anyway. There is almost always some improvement or another at a later stage in the production.

Modularfan · Post by **Modularfan** » Mon Feb 26, 2007 8:43 am

KarnEvil wrote:Does actually anyone know if this second modbus is fully independent, or just some minor afterthought? It might not be a very big deal afterall.

I sent a PM to GregAE about this (he wrote the manuals for the Tribute and Stage). He told me that the second mod destination is not independent from the first - they both share the same Amount control, and there's no way to scale or adust the secondary modulation level relative to the first. The Amount control sets the same modulation amount for both mod busses. This would make the second modbus more of a minor addition instead of a real hardware upgrade, IMO - one of those 'nice to have' things, but not really that big of a deal.

KarnEvil · Post by **KarnEvil** » Mon Feb 26, 2007 9:48 am

Thanks. Still I can see plenty of interesting uses for this second modbus (thought it shares the amount control with the first). Initially I had set my sights on the tribute, but now I'll definately get the stage version. Still, gonna miss the wood though..

[/quote]

I sent a PM to GregAE about this (he wrote the manuals for the Tribute and Stage). He told me that the second mod destination is not independent from the first - they both share the same Amount control, and there's no way to scale or adust the secondary modulation level relative to the first. The Amount control sets the same modulation amount for both mod busses. This would make the second modbus more of a minor addition instead of a real hardware upgrade, IMO - one of those 'nice to have' things, but not really that big of a deal.[/quote]

dlearyus · Post by **dlearyus** » Mon Feb 26, 2007 11:33 am

Bottom Line: I bought it because -
1) It's a MOOG
2) It's a TE
3) Does what it's supposed to do - WELL!

If i wanted more features i would have bought a Voyager
Maybe not the greatest marketing decision with the SE but these folks
at MOOG care about their customers and the quality of their products...rare in this day and age. Keep up the great design work and add a 3rd osc. in next years SE ;).

P.S. releasing the OS update ASAP may help to quell the angry villagers

electrical_engineer_gEEk · Post by **electrical_engineer_gEEk** » Mon Feb 26, 2007 11:39 am

KarnEvil wrote: It has never payed off being among the very first to buy a new product anyway. There is almost always some improvement or another at a later stage in the production.

EXACTLY...you are so right...i don't want to hear any bitching about this ever....if you can't understand this basic concept of technology you should be brought out behind the barn and shot.....

here is a tip to all the Little Phatty owners about how the future of this instrument will evolve.....
there will be a newer edition in the little phatty someday in the future....
it will have EXTRA NEW FEATURES.....
it will happen somewhere between 6months to 10 years.....
It WILL happen...it HAS happened...... and this sort of thing will happen until the end of time......

Mumpbeak · Post by **Mumpbeak** » Mon Feb 26, 2007 12:33 pm

electrical_engineer_gEEk wrote: EXACTLY...you are so right...i don't want to hear any bitching about this ever....if you can't understand this basic concept of technology you should be brought out behind the barn and shot......

err..I'm sorry is this a piece of your brain?
Basil Fawlty

Jazzpunk · Post by **Jazzpunk** » Mon Feb 26, 2007 2:39 pm

electrical_engineer_gEEk wrote: EXACTLY...you are so right...i don't want to hear any bitching about this ever....if you can't understand this basic concept of technology you should be brought out behind the barn and shot.....

Another brilliant insight from the peanut gallery.

Cheers

jon_kull · Post by **jon_kull** » Mon Feb 26, 2007 4:24 pm

PHC wrote:In my opinion this discussion should be limited ONLY to the people who bought the Tribute AFTER the features of the Stage were known (cause they had a choice and they thought that TE and SE were going to be the same thing).

I made my decision to purchase the Tribute after the pictures of the Stage (and some rough specs) became available. My decision was based solely on the fact that the tribute had wood ends and I had been told that the stage was the same exact synth with only cosmetic differences. I love my tribute and I'm very happy with it. It's the synth I wanted and it's the synth I got. I don't feel the need for the second mod routing and I'm happy and comfortable with my purchase.

I do however understand the frustration of people that bought a Tribute just to get the wood ends that would probably have bought a Stage had they known it would have the additional mod routing. I don't include myself in that group but I understand..

Moog Music Forum

Tribute = No Second Mod Destination

Because its a TE