Ring Modulator - Awsome! MuRF and Phaser...hum?

[Mrpuccolo]

Moogfooger Buddies,

I just got my RM, Phaser and MuRF and have been experimenting for hours trying to get something good out of them for my whistling...mixed results so far.

The Ring Modulator is an amazing piece of equipment in my opinion - even after only an hour of using it. It takes my pure tone and can even add a harmony tone that I can control with the Frequency knob (haven't tried a pedal yet). Almost like whistling two notes at once. It can make it sound erie or real bluesy/raspy - way cool. I even found a way to use the SQUARE WAVE/LFO to drop down the 2nd tone an interval when I slowly lower a note...unreal...got to work on controlling that one. This one is definately a keeper for me. I need to have a least two pedals for this one - for MOD/FREQUENCY and LSO/RATE...need to order some more M-Audio cheapies.

I have been very disappointed with what I can do with the MuRF. I beleive my problem is that my whistle tone is so pure (I'm a world champion jazz whistler), that the FILTERS don't have much affect. I've tried almost every combination of settings, but nothing interesting results. Animation has almost no affect at all. I was thinking that I might have better results if I could boost more harmonics out of my tone before sending it to the MuRF. Electro-Harmonix has a new HOG box (expensive) that might do the trick.

The Phaser as some affect on my whistling, but again, not like on guitar chords...lot's of harmonics there to work with I think.

Any suggestions!

Thanks,

Francesco Bonifazi - The Jazz Whistler
www.thejazzwhistler.com

[OysterRock]

I have been very disappointed with what I can do with the MuRF. I beleive my problem is that my whistle tone is so pure (I'm a world champion jazz whistler), that the FILTERS don't have much affect.

I think you've got it right here. The filtering effects aren't going to have as dramatic as an effect as it would harmonically rich signal such as a guitar. I'd imagine a whistle (especially a world class one ) doesn't have a ton of harmonic content.

The Ring Modulator is an amazing piece of equipment in my opinion - even after only an hour of using it.

Try feeding your whistle into the audio input and carrier input as the same time. A signal multiplied by itself doubles the frequency. That might sound kind of neat on a whistle, especially mixed in.

[GregAE]

<< Any suggestions? >>

A couple thoughts come to mind:

1. Ring Mod: Try a pitch shifter to lower the pitch of your whistle and route that signal to the RM's carrier input. Route the original whistle to the RM input. This arrangement will set up a constant frequency ratio for the RM to work with. Note: the result here will be highly dependant on how fast the pitch shifter responds. Might work, might not.

2. MuRF: I suspect you're right about the purity of your whistle being the reason why the MuRF doesn't work well. Have you tried overdriving the MuRF's input? How about running your whistle through a distortion device (to square up the signal) and then processing that through the MuRF? (I realize that this suggestion may be a bit 'over-the-top' for a pro like yourself - but if you're open to new ideas, then why not?)

3. Phaser: Like the MuRF, the problem is probably due to the purity of the tone. Altering the signal's waveshape (as in the MuRF suggestion above) will give the Phaser more to work with.

More:

4. Place the Phaser after the RM or MuRF.

5. Split the whistle signal and route one output into the Phaser, and then into the RM Carrier in. Route the other whistle signal into the RM input. This will probably result in very subtle changes (since the RM works on frequency differences and not phase differences), but might be interesting nonetheless.


Happy Experimenting!

Greg

[solarpanelasses]

i agree, using distortion would help a lot, using a thick heavy fuzz makes all my foogers(all my pedals for that matter) sound so rich and full.

[Mrpuccolo]

Greg,

First, yes, I'm a professional whistler, and do my own digital recording and mixing...but I'm a novice when it comes to effects that really alter/shape the tone. While I use reverbs, compressors etc. - the goal has always been minor adjustments not the fun/crazy stuff I'm trying now.

I did try over-driving the MuRF (only with it's own input DRIVE adjustment) but it didn't do a lot. I have a nice tube preamp I could try since tubes add nice harmonics...yes, an avenue to explore!

I'll head over to the local guitar shop to get a pitch-shifter or octave pedal as per your suggestion. Maybe just something to "fuzz-up" the sound might work to prep the signal before the MuRF or Phaser.

Am I assuming correctly, that a cheap Boss or other pedal won't have nearly the flexibility of the Moogfooger Phaser?

The RM and me are getting along pretty well - I've been using the expression pedal to control the FREQ knob. One technique I've found useful is to put the pedal all the wasy HEEL down, then whistle the root note of they key I'll do the song in, and then change the FREQ KNOB to the same note or a 3rd/5th up. Then the pedal is "set" for me to go up but always return to the "set" note...you guys have probably already developed such hints/tips.

Thanks again!

Francesco - The Jazz (and Electronic) Whistler
www.thejazzwhistler.com

[Mrpuccolo]

Greg,

Some results...I get more when I use a tube preamp between my mic and MuRF or Phaser, but no improvement with the RM (just as good with mic directly into RM). I have to over-drive the tube pre at the gain and then over-drive the Moogfooger input as well.

I get a lot of dripping noises effects with MuRF and some electronic games sounds (like firing a laser in a game). The phaser still seems to be weak in the swirling effects that I was expecting.

This seems to support the view that filters and phasers need a broader range of material to work with. Makes sense to me, but now I have the proof.

I wouldn't use anything I'm getting from the MuRF or Phaser in one of my compositions at this point, but I'll keep experiementing.

Thanks!

Francesco

[GregAE]

Francesco -

Went to your web site and listened to 'FunkyJ'. Very cool - at times it sounds like you are playing a jazz flute. Incredible technique!

Listening to FunkJ made me wonder if you've ever played with long delays to create loops (for accompanyment) or call-and-reponse type of things. Seems like a natural choice for an effect on your instrument.

- Greg

[Mrpuccolo]

Greg,

Glad you liked FunkyJ...yes, I do try to sound like flute/piccolo at times, piano, electric guitar and others in different pieces. So much whistling out there is so bad it gives us pro whistlers a bad rap.

I am the 2003 internatinal whistling champion for popular (vs. classical) music. I think my tone and improv abilities are what won it for me.

Many of my recent compositions were done using a looper - a new Gibson EchoPlex Plus digital unit (not the older tape-based model). I love this device - it's very powerful and I'm only using about half of what it can do. Reverse whistling is a cool sound.

Working with delays is on my list of things to learn. I have a TC Electronic M-one-XL effects unit which has delays in addition to great reverbs. I'm not hip to how to use the TAP function to set the delay properly. Is the Moogfooger Delay worth getting? - it's pretty expensive for 1 sec delay. There must be more to it than delay time.

My next CD after Air Play will feature more work with combos and electronic whistling...got to get better at that first.

Thanks for the help.

Ciao!

Francesco - The Electronic Whistler

[asd]

Working with delays is on my list of things to learn. I have a TC Electronic M-one-XL effects unit which has delays in addition to great reverbs. I'm not hip to how to use the TAP function to set the delay properly. Is the Moogfooger Delay worth getting? - it's pretty expensive for 1 sec delay. There must be more to it than delay time.

I don't know exactly what type of sound territory you want to get into, but the Moog delay is very different than a digital delay like a boss pedal (don't know anything about the tc electronic delay). There are lots of possibilities beyond just repeating/echoing your sound. I won't go on about it, but I will say that I think it's worth it.

On another note, I like working with delays a lot more than loops, especially when improvising. The looping tools became too much of a crutch for me and were a big constraint. Took some of the challenge out of playing for me.

[OysterRock]

I bet you could do some cool stuff by whistling with a looping device. I've seen a few looping performances, some were spectacular, some were so-so. I have yet to see a looping whistler, though!

[bentropy]

A cool looping tool is the Electrix Repeater. Electrix went out of business a couple years ago, but sometimes gives signals its coming back. Check out the Looper's Delight site for more info on this and other looping methods, etc.