Do drum triggers output a gate signal/ sawtooth, or a more complex higher waveform? I am trying to figure out a way to use triggers from the roland v-drums or other drum triggers to trigger the step patterns in the murf [rather than slamming on the tap pedal for complex beats.]
i might have to feed them into a gate/ rack..
hmm
matt
I guess i problem solve faster than other people find intrest reply 
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I am just going to get the cp-251, and a small modular unit from synthesizers.com that covers functions what my 251 and other moogerfoogers don’t. [you only need so many noise sources] they have [in their catalogue of classic moog modular interchangables] a device that creates some options on getting control voltage from an input signal. - http://www.synthesizers.com/q118.html I figure 2 of those modules would suit my needs, routing either drum triggers or a full drum mix minus overheads to get some fast gates with the rest of the band for use in time dependent effects. Depending if I am on the more random patterns, it may not matter how many I get [in terms of sometimes getting double triggered], as long as it is enough to sustain the delay-]
Also, after thinking- I am sure with this, a slew generator, the MF-101, and a couple other tweaks and LFOs- I can start to emulate some of what the mutronics mutator offeres for sound possibilities… though I won’t complain if anyone sends me their mutator:)
but do you know for sure that the tap input will accept a gate signal? i checked the manual and couldn’t find a reference to this.
man it’s too bad that the 8 envelope generators don’t have cv outs.
can we hack it 
hmm if it was fool proof i might but these things are too expensive i’m too scared of totally screwing it up. i plugged the wrong power supply in my murf once and it started making some very strange noises. almost gave me a heart attack.
hmm adding 8 outputs to a murf. you would almost have to put it in a new enclosure
I would rather have 8 inputs than 8 outputs. why not both when we are going all out ? - and link it to a external analogue sequencer or midi to cv control device to trigger each of the ranges.
you could do some of the murf effects with 8 individual band pass filters, an envelope generator, and several lfos or a sequencer… .
heck - i really want an envelope out on it- like the mf-101 has
does anyone even make an analog sequencer that has an in and out for each channel? i don’t know if i’ve ever seen one. the modcan and the synth.com both only have gate out for each channel
have you seen the modcan sequencer? that looks pretty sweet
man, i wish i could get a readout of the circuit board. [it is a 2 level board]. i don’t own a meter to test sadly… i can’t use my dad’s anymore … there are some unused pins and connection points on the board, that i am curious to what they have running through them…
gate in for each channel on the murf would make me happy.
me too if i actually had a synth with a gate out to trigger the murf. did you ever find out if the tap input will take a gate?
“does anyone even make an analog sequencer that has an in and out for each channel? i don’t know if i’ve ever seen one.”
http://www.metalbox.com/modules/seqsw.html
It can be used as a straight sequencer when nothing is plugged into the inputs, or as a sequential switch between audio sources or cv sources.
Also makes a 3-stage switch and scanner. Same idea, fewer stages.
As far as the original question, trigger outs from something like v-drums are probably just simple pulses. Really the same thing from a tempo tap pedal. Level and/or polarity might be the only issue, which is easily solved with the mixer on the CP-251.
If you’re thinking of going modular anyway, there are several modules out there that can extract a trigger/gate from audio.
I was on the border line for going modular anyways… So I took the plunge I was originally looking for a non modular solution..
anyways- the roland vdrums is a piezo transducer- each trigger sends a feed to the computer that sounds like a small tom [you can amp them directly]- the computer gates it, and adds preset sounds and volumes to that… maybe there is one with gate outs..
BTW> laughed at the Blacet improbability drive cute reference http://www.blacet.com/ID.html
Some more research
In the Beginning,
Dr. Bob Moog’s modular systems used a signal called “Trigger” to identify when a key on the keyboard was pressed and released. Of course, this signal could also be generated by other sources such as sequencers, foot pedals, drum controllers, etc. Triggers are used to start envelope generators, sequencers, etc, and are a critical function in any synthesizer system. Moog systems use 2 types of Triggers: Voltage Triggers (AKA V-Trig) and Switch Triggers (AKA S-Trig, sometimes called Shorting Trigger).
Voltage Triggers
V-Trig signals are patched using normal 1/4" plugs and jacks, and are approximately 3 volts when ON and 0 volts (Ground) when off. V-Trigs in a Moog modular are created by the 960 Sequential Controller (90% duty cycle) and by the 961 interface that can convert S-Trigs to V-Trigs. V-Trigs are the same as what we call a ‘Gate’ today. Gate signals allows for easier, more intutive patching and eliminate conversion.
Switch Triggers
S-Trig signals use a special 2-pin blade-type connector made by Cinch/Jones. Basically, an S-Trig is simply the signal being shorted to ground. This can be accomplished by a circuit, or by a passive (no power required) device such as a mechanical foot switch or push button. Moog keyboards produce S-Trigs and Moog 911 Envelope Generators use them to control their cycle. The one advantage to S-Trigs is that many source signals can be connected in parallel to create a logical OR (any signal makes it through). The disadvantage is that the S-Trig must go through a conversion module to interface to modules requiring a V-Trig (Gate).
Today,
Virtually all synthesizers use ‘Gates’ which are essentially V-Trigs. Usually Gate voltages are +5 volts or more. Usually they have a positive polarity, but not always, and some synthesizers have a switch to select polarity.
http://www.synthesizers.com/gates.html
That said- i bet the moogerfoogers use switch triggers, but voltage will work for them..
Just thought I’d add to this topic some of what I’ve found from using various equipment, including some Moogers:
The Moogers, use a kind of V-trig, or gate. I know that the MF101 ENV out sends a V-trig, not an S-trig. It’s enough of a signal to trigger some of my synths with gate input, but not all. I’m pretty sure the MURF also uses some form of volatge gate input and NOT switch trigger.
I’m not sure why the new Moog Music decided to stop using s-trig on their products, but I would guess it made more sense in the late 90s (as there would be virtually no s-trig compatibility with any other newer products). For that matter, s-trig never was particularly compatible with much of any other non-Moog products and it’s always been a topic of wonder why Moog decided to continue incorporating s-trigs on their post-modular products. Besides Moogs, I know of only some early Korgs that use s-trig.
There is a simple circuit, which is actually in the MIcroMoog manual (and reprinted on some websites) for converting V-trig to S-trig and Synthesizers.com sells this prefabricated circuit inside of a 1/4" to cinch-jones cable. Switch triggers don’t have to be Cinch-Jones connectors either. There are 1/4 S-trigs on many 80s Moogs and 70s Korgs.
As far as drum triggers are concerned, I’ve found that there can be all sorts of different triggers used on various products, but they are most typically audio triggers. I have an older Roland product, the Octapad and an accompaning Kick drum trigger and they are not compatible with S-trig or V-trig. However, as someone said, these audio triggers if processed could probably function as either an S-trig or a V-trig (depending on the polarity of the signal). My Roland kick pad has a switch on it to change it’s polarity, for instance. But even when switched to negative polarity, the signal is too low to work as an S-trig.
But any audio signal, if amplified enough, would probably work as a V-trig, at least. [/i]
good input eric..
a question though. with my .com, inorder to use gate triggers- I need to use the 142 pedal interface http://www.synthesizers.com/q142.html
how is it that the moogerfoogers can read a passive pedal for trigger input [tap input on the murf- i just checked] , if it truly needs a v-input trigger? Is there a way that they accept both? or what?
Thanks matt, for some reason, I really like reading and posting on this board; I think it might be a vicarious way experiencing these instruments but without actually buying the equipment. Although, I have owned owned alot of it over the years, and still have some…
I didn’t know that you need an interface to use gate triggers with a Synth.com system. I thought the Synth.com equipment uses standard gates/v-trig for triggering Envelopes?
A gate signal will often function as an envelope actually. For instance, if you send a gate signal to a VCA or VCF’s voltage input, they will open and close almost like they do when sent an envelope voltage. It’s all voltages, you know? Even audio signals are voltages. The interface module is there to correct the voltage level, to boost it or attentuate it so that it functions for the use you’re intending it for.
Therefore, one other thing about gates/v-trigs is that there isn’t a standard voltage level; and different manufacturer’s gate inputs respond (or don’t respond) to different gate voltages. So, on an Arp it may be 8v to trigger the gate, but on another synth, it may be 5v…
And then, of course, there’s S-trigs also… which short the voltage to gate. So, usually, when you insert an S-trig into a gate/v-trig input it gates opposite of what it should…when you hit a key the note turns off.
They accept both.
The thing with the Moogerfoogers is that they are made to be used with CVs or Pedal inputs. They do this with with multi-element(ring, tip, sleeve) jacks. A pedal input needs a voltage source, so the foogers send a CV out on the ring element to power the pedal. Because the pedal is just a potentiometer that attentuates the CV that is sent to it and then sends it back to the Fooger to respond to that attentuation.
But the Foogers also respond to normal CV when you use a normal tip/sleeve jack. The pedal voltage is just shorted out/ignored.
I believe the Synth.com interface also works like this. It has jacks for pedals… or maybe that’s another module. [/i]
makes sense. That helps clear up some confusion I was having..
to use certian control pedals and expression pedals on the .coms, you need the Q142 pedal interface to turn the switch trigger to a voltage gate high enough to trigger the various functions. You can also control +5/-5, 0/+5, -5/0 volts- which will help my applications out a lot. Most of my uses for a tap in will go straight to the foogers, so I guess I am covered…
FYI, my setup is a few foogers, the 251 processor- and soon the use of .coms to fill in a couple of holes… I have found getting the 251 is auctually cheaper than getting the same function by individual modules on .com, though they are slightly different… i live vicariously through the Arturia software- and put up with a tad bit of delay… a few hundred bucks to power a few thousand of toys
Yeah, I’ve never tried the Arturia Modular. I’m sure it can be useful, and alot of fun. But I’m not really a soft-synth enthusiast. I’ve downloaded some of those Arturia programs and I was amazed at how well it reproduced the static sound of the Mini, for instance. But, I don’t think they really capture the sound in motion.. like when you turn a knob… it doesn’t really sound or feel the same. I sort of doubt anything that complex could ever really be programmed… but who knows.
I don’t have the 251 either, and I’ve been thinking of picking one up, but I have most of it’s functions on my Arp Odyssey. I’ve also modified this Odyssey for modular capability, so I can send out the noise signal, sample+hold, lfos, env.s, etc. This was my way of getting some modular functions on a budget.