Moog Music Forum

I've played a Matrix 12 (and an Xpander, same thing only a module with 6 instead of 12 voices).

Never played any of the others but the Jupiter 8 would be da bomb for me. I like the tactile interface. The Matrix 12 is an incredible synth with tons of routing possibilities, though. Juno 106?!?! not in the same league at all, although they're great for what they are. They have nice fast envelopes and can be really fat in mono mode. Still not quite as cool as a Jupiter. I have had a Jupiter 6. I'd much, much, much rather have a JP6 than a Juno 106. Arpeggiator, 2 oscillator, multimode filter, just to name a few things it has.. Actually I have a 106, it is a synthplus 60, a 106 with speakers. Very nice. Just not really in the same league as the ones he's looking at.

I have always thought it would be cool to have a Prophet 5, because Bernie Worrell played one. Not being an extremely talented keyboard player, I would rather move to a monosynth if it meant having a few more tricks. Has anyone played a Roland SH-5? I have played a Moog Sonic 6. I like the ring modulator, the independent LFO,s lots of strange and interesting routing possibilities. Getting slightly off-subject I guess.

Electrong wrote:I've played a Matrix 12 (and an Xpander, same thing only a module with 6 instead of 12 voices).

Never played any of the others but the Jupiter 8 would be da bomb for me. I like the tactile interface. The Matrix 12 is an incredible synth with tons of routing possibilities, though.

So, how did you like the sound of the Matrix 12? Did you ever have any problems with it?

Yeah... the 106's and Polysix's of the world aren't in the same league, but pretty cool nonetheless. I'd love to get a Jupiter 8, a Memorymoog, and some kind of Oberheim someday... Thank god Dave Smith made the Prophet '08. and of course... thank Moog for the Voyager and LP.

And the Taurus... the weeks are counting down!!

I didn't have any problems with the Matrix 12. I didn't own it for very long, though. The thing is, any synth that is as expensive off the bat like a Matrix 12 is most likely going to have been taken good care of. I spent more time on the Xpander, though, that was in an analog synth programming class. Again, they're the same thing except the Xpander has "only" 6 voices, but it is set up for more extensive MIDI controllability, I think.

About which synth is more reliable, I have heard some things about Jupiter 8s and their needing more work, but let's follow this hypothetical situation:

You have a big wad of cash and want to buy a vintage polysynth, one of the "big boys." So you go and look at the market and part of your decision-making process is "how reliable is this synth?" I would think that if you are serious about the synth, then it would be more a matter of which one has the sounds, or features and arrangement of the sounds, that you want, NOT is it reliable, more or less, than another one, UNLESS the particular model of synth is KNOWN to be a MONEY PIT of a synth.

If it isn't a money pit, then I would think that you're probably going to find the synths priced accordingly. If they need some tech work you may even find a savings on that synth that over-compensates the cost to have it fixed/serviced.

I'm going off of memory here, but I know the Matrix 12 has no arpeggiator. It has several tricks up its sleeve, but it isn't known to have the fastest envelopes, and apparently the envelopes can slow down if the processor is bogged down by the sound being programmed with several modulation routings.

That being said, though, if you could program it you would be rewarded because you can choose various routings like a modular, whereas most of the signal path on the Jupiter 8 is (as I understand it) "hardwired."

I recently talked to a guy who has a studio and owns both an Xpander and a Chroma and he things his Chroma is awesome for certain reasons. He loves his Xpander too, though. Each different synth has its personality and sound(s) and that would be the first place I would look in determining which poly-synth to purchase (if I had that huge wad of cash!)

This would be a great topic for the Analog Heaven website, or another synth-oriented site that has members who own other brands of synths besides Moogs. Your list doesn't even include a Moog so it's questionable how reliable these responses would be (although I would try making my own mind up before listening to alot of people who may or may not even know what they're talking about.)

Electrong wrote:You have a big wad of cash and want to buy a vintage polysynth, one of the "big boys." So you go and look at the market and part of your decision-making process is "how reliable is this synth?" I would think that if you are serious about the synth, then it would be more a matter of which one has the sounds, or features and arrangement of the sounds, that you want, NOT is it reliable, more or less, than another one, UNLESS the particular model of synth is KNOWN to be a MONEY PIT of a synth.

Well, if someone's willing to fork ~4000 euros for a vintage polysynth, he is either very serious or has enough money to spend just for fun, right?

My personal guess, without having prior experience with any of these synths, is that you can't go wrong with any of those. Even I don't like it, the resale value is pretty high so it's not much of a loss (I hope). I am just doing my homework. Like I said, the synth I want most is the Synthex, but if it has severe issues and it spends most time being serviced, rather than staying in my studio, then maybe I should pick another one instead.

All of these synths I mentioned are fully restored to their original cosmetic condition, electronics inside serviced, calibrated and so on. I have found them in www.rlmusic.co.uk. I know that 4000 euros is A LOT of money (besides, I could get a small modular with that amount) but I just love the sound of the Synthex and it's gotta be mine.

Here's a photo of the previous Synthex that RLMusic sent me:



(If anyone uses this photo just make a reference to where you got it from)

As I'm not aware of the entire list of synths I can't comment on their reliability. But I bet that if they were designed well, any of them would be reliable if they were gone through with a tech and ready to go. 4000 euros seems like a lot of money but I wouldn't be surprised if any of these items holds their value and/or increases in value over time, unless you paid too much for it when you first purchase it.

All great points, Electrong. Good luck shopping everyone!!

4000 eur?

phewww...

You'd get a mint conditions prophet t8 + spare parts for that!

Then you'd stop worrying about anything related with poly sounds, and focus on your minimoog.

a synthex goes for 2000, a ob8 for 1200/1300...

ozy wrote:a synthex goes for 2000, a ob8 for 1200/1300...

Holy macaroni! Can you find me a Synthex in near-mint condition for 2000? I will come to Milan and buy you a grand pizza.

Mine is gone, sorry. 1800.

But I recently checked for prices before selling an OB-8, and used the synthex for reference, well...

couldn't fetch more that 1800/2000

I mean: 1800/2000 cash by professionals.

Of course you could be asked 3000 by a completist reluctant seller, or you could even be BID 3000 by the usual cash-strapped loser offering to trade in his "collection of slightly used power-supply chords and a mint condition vintage Bontempi hammond replica with real cardboard keybed"...

Was yours in mint condition? Also, where did you look for prices? Any specific place?

Mint conditions, manual.

I checked through the "grapevine": fellow musicians, usual web sites, technical repair guys, and my usual hardware providers.

You must maybe understand that I am very sceptic of the "vintage" factor:

a synth is worth some "vintage" premium IF and only IF its age implies more discrete components, or more man-hours spent in manufacturing, which is the legacy of top-notch synths which were expensive when they were sold first, and rightfully remain expensive.

A Davolisynth was junk and will always remain junk, a prophet 600 is not worth a vintage premium, a prodigy will never be WORTH the prices you see on websites (and maybe really SPENT by some less than competent knob-twisting teenager), the first version of prophet 5 is just a pain in the back and I got rid of 2 of them before going crazy,

on the other hand, a prophet t8 will always be more expensive and more worth than any shitty 88 keys fatar-powered sample-based sequencer-toting workstation, a minimoog was rightfully worth any price until the voyager was available.

IMHO, the synthex is a cheaper, thinner, colder OB-8.

Ozy makes sense. Ozy, what is your opinion on the Mini D now that the Voyager is available? Obviously they were a more labor intensive synth by far than the new Voyagers.

ozy wrote: A Davolisynth was junk and will always remain junk, a prophet 600 is not worth a vintage premium, a prodigy will never be WORTH the prices you see on websites (and maybe really SPENT by some less than competent knob-twisting teenager), the first version of prophet 5 is just a pain in the back and I got rid of 2 of them before going crazy,

on the other hand, a prophet t8 will always be more expensive and more worth than any shitty 88 keys fatar-powered sample-based sequencer-toting workstation, a minimoog was rightfully worth any price until the voyager was available.

IMHO, the synthex is a cheaper, thinner, colder OB-8.

Everybody has their preferences, but I don't think that any of these 4 synths I listed is not worth the term "vintage".