Beatstep pro + Sub 37

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shaygan
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Beatstep pro + Sub 37

Post by shaygan » Sun Oct 25, 2015 7:51 am

Hi! I just bought an arturia beatstep pro to control my sub 37 via cv, havent tried it yet but I found this comment on a youtube video stating "Just a reminder to anyone using the BeatStep PRO with moog gear, you have to attenuate the voltage from 10v down to 5v, if you are connecting via CV. If not, you will fry your moog."
:shock:
Sorry not an expert on cv and certainly dont want to "fry" my sub 37 so I'm a bit confused here, does it mean I just can't use it for now without an attenuator (and what kind should be added)? Or is this an irrevelant comment I should ignore and just go with it. Hard to find lots of comments on this particular combo (sub 37 + beatstep pro) but I found one or two and they weren't mentioning the use of attenuator.
Could someone clarify this?
Thanks!

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Flareless
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Re: Beatstep pro + Sub 37

Post by Flareless » Sun Oct 25, 2015 8:21 am

Page 8 of the 1.1 manual states'
The PITCH CV, FILTER CV, and VOL CV inputs each accepts an expression pedal (such as the Moog EP- 3)
or a control voltage signal from 0 to +5 volts.
I don't know about frying the Moog but it definitely looks like +10 is outside its threshold.
Rich

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What can this strange device be? When I touch it, it gives forth a sound - Neil Peart

jsharpphoto
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Re: Beatstep pro + Sub 37

Post by jsharpphoto » Sun Oct 25, 2015 6:18 pm

That was me!

Yes. Not instant damage, but I confirmed with both Arturia and Moog tech support, that there will be long-term damage from over-volting your inputs. Why don't you just connect it via midi? Or build an attenuator box.
Moog Format Modular
Model D (2016)
Moog Subsequent37
Oberheim OB-6
Sequential Rev2

shaygan
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Re: Beatstep pro + Sub 37

Post by shaygan » Mon Oct 26, 2015 3:56 am

Now if that's the case that's really disappointing and careless from Arturia not to mention it. Moog synths are very popular they all have CV how come they would not even consider to warn you on package, manual or anywhere actually that it's not compatible and will actually damage it, unbelievable, Im definitely contacting them on that matter.
Of course midi is an alternative but you're supposed to be aware that in fact it's the only safe way. I would rather use CV, how do you build an attenuator, is it something available? Thank you.

jsharpphoto
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Re: Beatstep pro + Sub 37

Post by jsharpphoto » Mon Oct 26, 2015 9:12 am

There are diagrams online on how to wire a attentiator. It's not difficult, with even 101 level soldering skills. I would do it like this...

1/8 inch input jack
Inline potentiometer
1/4 inch output jack

You need 6 of those. Since you are cutting the voltage perfectly in half, you COULD use a resistor instead of the potentiometer, but that would lock you into 5v. Sometimes, like if you go modular, or something, might need 7v.
Moog Format Modular
Model D (2016)
Moog Subsequent37
Oberheim OB-6
Sequential Rev2

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Rufus the Dog
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Re: Beatstep pro + Sub 37

Post by Rufus the Dog » Mon Oct 26, 2015 10:24 am

Moog CV input is 1 volt per octave with a 5 volts max range i.e. 5 octaves. I assume (note the 'assume') that it depends on where you set the starting 'footage' of the VCO i.e. 32', 16' etc

The Beatstep Pro also has a 1volt/octave setting but a 10 volt i.e. 10 octave range - I assume for modular kit that can span a wider range

just halving the voltage range from the Beatstep to the Moog will just give you quarter tones I think

I have both bit of kit so I will experiment later but I expect someone with greater knowledge will be along shortly :D

btw this is from the Voyager manual :-

Pitch:
The PITCH jack allows you to connect an external CV or expression pedal to control the Voyager’s pitch. All three oscillators are effected by this connection. The effective input range is -5 to +5 V, where a positive CV will add to the oscillator dial settings, and a negative CV will subtract from the settings. If an expression pedal is plugged in, the pitch can only be made to increase since the pedal connection supplies only a posi- tive voltage.

Sub Phatty :-

CONTROL VOLTAGE IN
The PITCH CV, FILTER CV, and VOL CV inputs each accepts an expression pedal (such as the Moog EP- 2) or a control voltage signal from 0 to +5 volts. If you connect an expression pedal to VOL CV, you can use your foot to control the Sub Phatty’s output level. If you connect an expression pedal to FILTER CV, you can sweep the filter cutoff in the same manner. The PITCH CV and FILTER CV inputs are calibrated so that a one-volt change in the control voltage will result in a one-octave change in frequency.







R.

shaygan
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Re: Beatstep pro + Sub 37

Post by shaygan » Mon Oct 26, 2015 12:34 pm

Ok thanks for clarifications! Arturia is not confirming the "frying" thing (nor saying it won't). They are pointing me toward this device, a bit expensive and unfortunate to have to buy something again but it's perfect for this matter. I guess I should have been aware of all the specifications beforehand when I just took for granted it would work as both have cv... and seller of course told me it should be fine :I
Thanks.

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Rufus the Dog
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Re: Beatstep pro + Sub 37

Post by Rufus the Dog » Mon Oct 26, 2015 1:19 pm

For my Voyager applying a 0 to 5 volt voltage to the Pitch input will 'add' to the VCO's footage setting so selecting 8' and playing the bottom F key with 0 volts will make no change in pitch - adding 3 volts will increase the tone of the bottom F key up by 3 octaves. So, for each footage setting you can add up to 5 octaves (and for the Voyager subtract 5 octaves with a -5 volt input assuming you have that many octaves to spare)

I haven't tried with my Sub37 but imagine it works the same with the +/- octave key setting the base note and the input CV adding to the pitch.

R.

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Rufus the Dog
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Re: Beatstep pro + Sub 37

Post by Rufus the Dog » Mon Oct 26, 2015 2:24 pm

Beatstep Pro :-

If I measure the Pitch CV for the Sequencer 1 output and set all the Knobs to play C0 I get a constant 2 volts, if I dial all the knobs to C6 I get a constant 8 volts - 6 volts for 6 octaves.

If I stop sequencing and use the pads as a 1 octave + 1 note keyboard then with both the Oct- and Oct+ pads unlit bottom C gives me 5 volts and top C gives 6 volts. Using the Oct- and Oct+ pads over the full range gives CV ranges of 2 to 3 volts for the lowest Octave up to 8 to 9 volts for the top octave.

Not sure, yet, how I get a lower limit of 0 volts but then as C0 is around 32Hz not sure you need C-1 and C-2 :D


R.

Shaky Bacon
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Re: Beatstep pro + Sub 37

Post by Shaky Bacon » Mon Oct 26, 2015 9:06 pm

Shaygan: Your last post states: "They are pointing me toward this device, a bit expensive and unfortunate to have to buy something again but it's perfect for this matter." To whom are you referring at Arturia and what is the device you're referencing? I recently acquired a BeatStep Pro and would be interested to know.

mesa
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Re: Beatstep pro + Sub 37

Post by mesa » Tue Oct 27, 2015 10:59 am

shaygan wrote:Ok thanks for clarifications! Arturia is not confirming the "frying" thing (nor saying it won't). They are pointing me toward this device, a bit expensive and unfortunate to have to buy something again but it's perfect for this matter. I guess I should have been aware of all the specifications beforehand when I just took for granted it would work as both have cv... and seller of course told me it should be fine :I
Thanks.

Whats the device they are pointing you towards??? I need this :)

I had the beatstep and Slim phatty working with the cv (sound a lot better than it does with midi the sliding notes sounds great) then the slim just died screen went blank, I had to buy a debugger and take the moog apart, connect it up and send the firmware back into the phatty all works now, but not used the cv since,

I really don't know how to solder or make things like attentiator anyone now where I could buy an attentiator.

Thanks
Moog Slim phatty, Moog Sub 37, Moog Minataur, Dave Smith Tetra, Win10 64bit, Ableton Live 9.6, Ableton Push, Focusrite Scarlet 6I6, Arturia Beatstep Pro.

mesa
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Re: Beatstep pro + Sub 37

Post by mesa » Tue Oct 27, 2015 11:12 am

Just seen this then as I was looking on the internet for a cv attentiator

https://littlebits.cc/bits/control-voltage

this is what it had to say do you think this could work,

CV In
The CV module can scale incoming voltages as high as 12V down to the 5V system the littleBits system employs. To use the CV module to control your other littleBits modules, connect the control device to the “CV In” jack. CV signals that come in through the "CV In" jack are routed to the output bitSnap™. The "CV In" jack is a switching jack so that any CVs coming in through the input bitSnap™ are not routed to the bitSnap output. When using the CV module as an input, you can control the pitch of oscillator modules, the cutoff of filter modules, trigger the envelope module, or control the speed of the micro sequencer module (put the micro sequencer into “Step” mode for this).

would I need 3.
1 for pitch velocity and gate ?

Most probably better than this but I cant find any :(
Moog Slim phatty, Moog Sub 37, Moog Minataur, Dave Smith Tetra, Win10 64bit, Ableton Live 9.6, Ableton Push, Focusrite Scarlet 6I6, Arturia Beatstep Pro.

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Rufus the Dog
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Re: Beatstep pro + Sub 37

Post by Rufus the Dog » Tue Oct 27, 2015 11:21 am

I could well be wrong but I don't think you want to 'scale' down the Beatstep Pro output as both it and Moogs work on 1volt per octave. What you could really do with is something that subtracts 2 volts from the output of the Beatstep so that C0 becomes 0 volts and C5 becomes 5 volts then only use that range of notes from the CV output of the Beatstep and set the Octave switch on the Moog to suit.


R.

mesa
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Re: Beatstep pro + Sub 37

Post by mesa » Tue Oct 27, 2015 11:49 am

Rufus the Dog wrote:I could well be wrong but I don't think you want to 'scale' down the Beatstep Pro output as both it and Moogs work on 1volt per octave. What you could really do with is something that subtracts 2 volts from the output of the Beatstep so that C0 becomes 0 volts and C5 becomes 5 volts then only use that range of notes from the CV output of the Beatstep and set the Octave switch on the Moog to suit.


R.
Maybe !

I don't really get CV, I know what it dose but not how it works, There are a lot of setting in the arturia midi control app for the CV setting of the beatstep


Settings in the Midi control app

SEQ PITCH : V/Oct or Hz/Volt
SEQ 0V MIDI Note : C-2 upto G8
SEQ GATE : V-trig or S-trig
Moog Slim phatty, Moog Sub 37, Moog Minataur, Dave Smith Tetra, Win10 64bit, Ableton Live 9.6, Ableton Push, Focusrite Scarlet 6I6, Arturia Beatstep Pro.

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Rufus the Dog
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Re: Beatstep pro + Sub 37

Post by Rufus the Dog » Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:11 pm

If you can start at C-2 then that is 0 volts and if you can work from C-2 to C3 for you sequences you will get 0 to 5 volts for five octaves on the Moog starting at whatever Octave setting/footage you are set to and not damage the Moog


R.

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