Tuning the Phatty

geoscience · Post by **geoscience** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 11:07 am

How well are these Phatty's at holding pitch as you play up the keyboard. If I tune mine to middle C using a tuning program in my DAW, and play up or down an octave, the pitch will go sharp or flat very slightly off of 440 Hz. The farther away from middle c, the sharper or flatter it goes. Is this normal for true analog synthesis? I have only worked with virtual analog so I am trying to figure out what is "normal" for this machine.

Geoscience

carbon111 · Post by **carbon111** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 9:17 pm

No, that's not normal at all, I've got plenty of analog synths with rock solid tuning. That behaviour usually means the oscillators need to be scaled.

geoscience · Post by **geoscience** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 11:05 pm

Thanks for the reply carbon111. I am going back to Asheville on Monday to have the "Buzz" sound fixed. I guess I'll add this to the list.

-Geoscience

carbon111 · Post by **carbon111** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 11:21 pm

No problem, glad to help!

BTW - you guys are scareing the crap out of me. I may hold off for a "performer" edition at this point.

I've aleady got one sick keyboard that needs warranty repair right now...don't need a second one

I know, I'm a wuss...

goldphinga · Post by **goldphinga** » Sun Aug 06, 2006 5:54 am

why doesnt everyone stop panicking.

how much out of tune is the board? How did you check the tuning? More detail would be appreciated before everyone on the group starts assuming their LP is gonna be faulty.

As it happens most analogs do go slightly flat or sharp up and down the keyboard but i do stress the word slightly.

geoscience · Post by **geoscience** » Sun Aug 06, 2006 11:07 am

Sorry,

I was not trying to create a panic. I was using a tuning plug-in in Logic 7.1 and running the Phatty through it. I'm not use to true analog synths so I was wanted to know what to expect. I did manage to talk to my neighbor who has a gear list as impressive as yours Goldphinga, and he told me that this is normal.

goldphinga · Post by **goldphinga** » Sun Aug 06, 2006 11:20 am

Dont be sorry man! Im just surprised people would answer on the board saying that this isnt normal, when it is the nature of all analog synths to be slightly out at each end.

If its out by semitone at each end then i would say something is wrong, but otherwise if it sounds ok and you are happy then thats the main thing.

All the best

pureoldsound · Post by **pureoldsound** » Sun Aug 06, 2006 12:12 pm

carbon111 wrote:No problem, glad to help!

BTW - you guys are scareing the crap out of me. I may hold off for a "performer" edition at this point.

I've aleady got one sick keyboard that needs warranty repair right now...don't need a second one

I know, I'm a wuss...

I am with you Carbon...I am on the list at a store for a tribute...I've had it with repairs on old synth, that's the only reason why I want something new...I rather wait until they get it right....So far fixing all my analog synths have been months of waiting plus a lot of shipping fees, etc....no thank you....

LWG · Post by **LWG** » Sun Aug 06, 2006 12:20 pm

carbon111 wrote: I've aleady got one sick keyboard that needs warranty repair right now....

James,

To which one are you referring?

Regards,

Lawrence

writeroxie · Post by **writeroxie** » Tue Aug 08, 2006 5:53 pm

can anyone tell me how quickly the LP goes into tune when you start it up?

my source takes a good 20 minutes to find some sort of stable pitch.

thewaag · Post by **thewaag** » Tue Aug 08, 2006 6:12 pm

writeroxie wrote:my source takes a good 20 minutes to find some sort of stable pitch.

I know what you mean about the Source warming up to get in tune. I love my Source but it is worthless for at least 10 minutes after turning it on. It is COMPLETELY out of tune--WAY out of tune. My Model D is in tune from the minute I turn it on. I thought that the Source was supposed to be an improvement with all the new technology!!

All part of analog!!

carbon111 · Post by **carbon111** » Tue Aug 08, 2006 6:12 pm

writeroxie wrote:can anyone tell me how quickly the LP goes into tune when you start it up?

my source takes a good 20 minutes to find some sort of stable pitch.

At least it dosen't take an hour like my CS60

That said, no modern analog sould have any scaling issues out of the gate (a short keyboard should track to within a cent or two)...or indicator malfunctions or a loud fixed buzzing in the audio path. I'm going to wait on the LP until I can play one in person.

thewaag · Post by **thewaag** » Tue Aug 08, 2006 7:51 pm

From what little I know....

Both my Source and my Model D have small pots that have a slot for a screwdriver head. You turn these left or right to tune or scale. At the factory, after the instrument was adjusted, they would put something like Loctite on the adjustment head to hold it in place during shipping or transporting from gig to gig.

I would imagine that this is similar to what is done on the LP, although there may be a more modern method of manufacture and adjustment now days.

A rough ride from UPS or Fed Ex could break that Loctite bond and let the range and scale pots get out of adjustment. From what it sounds like, some of these poor LP's have had a pretty rough ride from the factory to their new home.

I don't recall seeing range and scale instructions in the LP manual. It doesn't make sense to have to send it in to Moog every time you want it adjusted.....

The Minimoog Model D is simple to tune and range and scale. It can be done without taking anything apart. It can be done by anyone who has a good ear, but it is best if you have the proper equipment to get it exactly in tune.

For whatever reason, the Source was not easy to range and scale or tune. It has to be taken apart to get to the pots. Seems kind of silly to have designed it this way. Once you are into the guts of the machine, it only takes a minute or two to tune up.

I wonder how it will be on the LP.....

goldphinga · Post by **goldphinga** » Wed Aug 09, 2006 6:11 am

i wish people would stop slagging the LP until theyve spent some proper time with one. its like people are wanting to rip this synth to shreds deliberately.

mine should be delievered today so im reserving judgement for a couple o weeks until ive used and abused it on some tracks.

i think most early opinions on gear are usually dubious to say the least. AND i suspect many people who will be buying the LP and asking questions on here dont have much prior analog synth experience, not all, but many.

its great that moogs are becoming available to a new fan base but slightly naive questions come with the territory.

these boards can do more damage to a synths rep than good sometimes, so we'd all be stupid to take opinions on here as gospel.

one persons experience with LP does not mean that the whole job lot is an out of tune light flickering, buzzy mess!

peas

DG

writeroxie · Post by **writeroxie** » Wed Aug 09, 2006 8:47 am

thewaag wrote:
writeroxie wrote:my source takes a good 20 minutes to find some sort of stable pitch.
I know what you mean about the Source warming up to get in tune. I love my Source but it is worthless for at least 10 minutes after turning it on. It is COMPLETELY out of tune--WAY out of tune. My Model D is in tune from the minute I turn it on. I thought that the Source was supposed to be an improvement with all the new technology!!

All part of analog!!

We took the Source on tour and unless we had the room/chance to plug it in and let it warm-up (on-stage) for 30+ minutes... it was useless. It's tough to find room to warm it up that long, where we won't have to unplug it again before we play. I'm worrying the band playing before us might kick it over or use it as a table for their beers.

Analog keeps it interesting.

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