Can we have some simple examples?

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monsieurx
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue May 06, 2014 8:29 am

Can we have some simple examples?

Post by monsieurx » Mon Dec 22, 2014 2:58 pm

Usually when i get a synth, i twist and shout until i see how far it can go...

With the sub 37, my first Moog (actually the second if you count a Werkstatt i got while waiting for the Sub)

I've played a bit (got it 3 weeks ago) but i've made, i feel, little progress to find what the sub is all about...

The presets are ok (most are so so... imoho) but, i must add, i've found some amazing sounds...

The filter is amazing, the acid is NICE, the bass is just down the basement... those lfos and envelopes... Awesome synth, but why is it so hard to get to a sound?

Made some amazing wah sound out of a bass preset... But i can't get as a varied sound as the Werkstatt (of all things...)...

So i was wondering which button or feature (or combos) did you find that makes the sub stand out sonically or change it's character 90 or 180 degrees?

mattyp
Posts: 76
Joined: Tue Dec 16, 2014 2:27 pm

Re: Can we have some simple examples?

Post by mattyp » Mon Dec 22, 2014 3:42 pm

simple, I just compared it to my DSI mopho. Don't get me wrong, the mopho is a great synth but compared to the sub 37 it just sounds a bit weak
Moog Sub 37, DSI Mopho KB, Korg ms20 mini, Korg M50, Korg Karma, Yamaha Motif Xf6, Yamaha DX7, Novation K Station, Waldorf Blofeld, Siel DK80, cyclone analogic tt 303

lushr
Posts: 161
Joined: Wed Oct 27, 2010 11:19 pm

Re: Can we have some simple examples?

Post by lushr » Tue Dec 23, 2014 4:09 am

One of my fave moments was turning on the Arpeggiator on the duo organ preset which is using the filter pole switching from memory. It sounds great. I love playing with duo mode in general, almost everything sounds good resonating with other notes.

But yeah my presets have been pretty simple sounds I guess, I'm still learning the sequencer. I haven't spent a lot of time with it. I think the synth sounds best when the filter is sweeping for example and that means getting into the modulation which is still a bit beyond me, but if I were brave, I'd get the LFO doing a big slow sweep of the filter, and playing with the envelope loops to see what polyrhythms I could come up with, that would still keyboard reset.... You could get some sort of star burst effects by having lots of modulation with keyboard reset to start it again each time.

I've also had fun exploring some sound which use aftertouch for whacky modulation, so if you press really hard you get amazing effects. It's all there in the presets, all the different tricks you can combine.

The best inspiration is always to think of a fave synth sound and try to recreate it.
___________________________________________________
LP Stage II, LE Sub37

epignosis567
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Joined: Sat Sep 20, 2014 7:58 pm

Re: Can we have some simple examples?

Post by epignosis567 » Mon Dec 29, 2014 2:05 pm

I think that there's a tendency to want to examine patches, but really the best thing you can do is just sit there going one knob at a time thinking about how it effects the sound. All modulation is basically the same thing, just in a different form/vehicle. If you just sit down and spend a day or two playing with it there's really not much to learn. And soon you'll be getting into the modular world and selling the clothes off your children's backs!

mattyp
Posts: 76
Joined: Tue Dec 16, 2014 2:27 pm

Re: Can we have some simple examples?

Post by mattyp » Wed Dec 31, 2014 3:41 am

The one thing i have been trying to get is vowel sounds like the model d but i cant seem to find how that is done. I tried google and it turned up nothing. what i want is a sort oh aaaaiiiieeee sound.
Any ideas?
Moog Sub 37, DSI Mopho KB, Korg ms20 mini, Korg M50, Korg Karma, Yamaha Motif Xf6, Yamaha DX7, Novation K Station, Waldorf Blofeld, Siel DK80, cyclone analogic tt 303

MoogProg
Posts: 211
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2014 11:09 am

Re: Can we have some simple examples?

Post by MoogProg » Wed Dec 31, 2014 10:06 am

I'll give this a try, and attempt to descibe how I created a new sound last night.

Start with an INIT patch, and follow the instructions. Be sure to move each knob to ensure the Sub37 recognizes every setting.

Reverse Solo

OSC1: Sine 2' Vol6
Sub OSC: OFF
OSC2: Sine 2' Vol6 Beat -1
Noise: OFF

Filter: Cutoff 20Khz (wide open), EG AMT -3, Slope 12db, Resonance 1

MOD1: Sine, Rate ~10, Pitch Amt just above minimum with Mod Wheel controlling the amount (by default). This is a typical Mod Wheel LFO effect. un-SYNC the MOD (sync is default for this MOD)

MOD2: This is where the "good stuff" starts to happen! Source=Filter EG, Select both OSC1 Wave and OSC2 Wave buttons and set the MOD2 AMT to full right.

You are now "sweeping" the waveform from pulse-to-sine using the Filter EG to shape the effect. Let's set the Filter EG next.

Filter EG: Attack 10, Decay 1, Sustain 0, Release 1
Also select MULTI TRIG and RESET

Amplitude EG: Attack 1 (full left), Decay ~2, Susatin 5, Release ~8 secs (long release).

We should now hear:

"Click" attack created by the Filter EG RESET, and the negative Filter EG AMT.

"Sweep" sound created as the waveforms change from pulse to a sustaining sine wave.

Long fade decay to create the illusion of a backwards track.

So... did this work for anyone, or are my instructions to vague? HNY!
Last edited by MoogProg on Wed Dec 31, 2014 11:40 am, edited 1 time in total.

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_DemonDan_
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Re: Can we have some simple examples?

Post by _DemonDan_ » Wed Dec 31, 2014 10:44 am

mattyp wrote:The one thing i have been trying to get is vowel sounds like the model d but i cant seem to find how that is done. I tried google and it turned up nothing. what i want is a sort oh aaaaiiiieeee sound.
Any ideas?

Hi mattyp,

Vowel sounds typically require at least two filters at once:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Formant

See the chart halfway down on the right side.
_ :twisted: _DemonDan_ :twisted: _

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_DemonDan_
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Re: Can we have some simple examples?

Post by _DemonDan_ » Wed Dec 31, 2014 10:50 am

This page has a frequency table that gives three formant frequencies for each vowel for Male, Female, and Child:

http://www.greenoak.com/crystal/vowels.html
_ :twisted: _DemonDan_ :twisted: _

mattyp
Posts: 76
Joined: Tue Dec 16, 2014 2:27 pm

Re: Can we have some simple examples?

Post by mattyp » Wed Dec 31, 2014 12:41 pm

Thanks Dan. I understand all that but I've seen it done on minimoog using osc 3 modulating cutoff frequency at audio rate. Don't think the sub 37 lfo's go high enough. Almost got it but not quite.
Found this on YouTube
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=aMywGcOub7E
Moog Sub 37, DSI Mopho KB, Korg ms20 mini, Korg M50, Korg Karma, Yamaha Motif Xf6, Yamaha DX7, Novation K Station, Waldorf Blofeld, Siel DK80, cyclone analogic tt 303

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_DemonDan_
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Re: Can we have some simple examples?

Post by _DemonDan_ » Wed Dec 31, 2014 3:04 pm

mattyp wrote:Found this on YouTube
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=aMywGcOub7E

Wow! I would never have believed you could get that many varieties of convincing vocal timbres from a Minimoog.

I'm getting a Voyager RME very soon and that will be the first thing I dig into.
_ :twisted: _DemonDan_ :twisted: _

MoogProg
Posts: 211
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Re: Can we have some simple examples?

Post by MoogProg » Wed Dec 31, 2014 3:46 pm

mattyp wrote:Don't think the sub 37 lfo's go high enough. Almost got it but not quite.


^Same here. Even tried using MOD1 (Constant ON) to push the rate of MOD2 (Full HIGH Rate) but it won't go any faster than Full HIGH. Verified by slowing things down and hearing the results of a Mod Wheel movement speeding the rate back up to the same max as before. So it seems there is a limit to the "audible-range LFO" of the Sub37. Mostly, I achieved 'noisy garbles'.

But that sure is a cool Model D trick in the video!

mattyp
Posts: 76
Joined: Tue Dec 16, 2014 2:27 pm

Re: Can we have some simple examples?

Post by mattyp » Wed Dec 31, 2014 11:35 pm

I got a sort of oooh ahhhh sound but cant get the eeee. It's a shame we cant use osc 2 when its disconnected from the kb. There is an option in the mod edit page but it seems that it follows pitch voltage and therefore can't be used as an lfo. Don't know whether its possible to have that for a future firmware update or even be able to use the digital sine lfo and have that at a higher rate.
Moog Sub 37, DSI Mopho KB, Korg ms20 mini, Korg M50, Korg Karma, Yamaha Motif Xf6, Yamaha DX7, Novation K Station, Waldorf Blofeld, Siel DK80, cyclone analogic tt 303

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BrufordRules
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Re: Can we have some simple examples?

Post by BrufordRules » Fri Jan 02, 2015 8:18 am

Awesome video the Minimoog Vocal Sounds.

It would be great to have really fast LFOs in the Sub 37 or can use the oscillators freely as a LFOs. I hope people from Moog implement that in future firmwares.

In the video, it seems he set the oscillator 3 at 2'. Somebody knows how many Hz we are talking about?

Thanks in advance.

Jeffery&wayne
Posts: 21
Joined: Sun Oct 05, 2014 9:31 pm

Re: Can we have some simple examples?

Post by Jeffery&wayne » Fri Jan 02, 2015 8:37 am

How I got a talking sound out of a voyager was by FM and then a filter sweep with a fare amount of resonense.

I would love it if in an update they could have osc2 FM osc1 so I could do the same trick with the sub37.

Also messing around I got some vowel sounds from the 37 but they were not fm talking sounds that I got from the voyager.

mattyp
Posts: 76
Joined: Tue Dec 16, 2014 2:27 pm

Re: Can we have some simple examples?

Post by mattyp » Fri Jan 02, 2015 9:05 am

another alternative is to use the CV inputs and an external source. connect to pitch for FM and to filter for vowel sounds. Not sure of the implications of doing this though, wouldn't want to fry anything.
I wonder if I can utilize the patch bay on the MS20 mini for this.
Moog Sub 37, DSI Mopho KB, Korg ms20 mini, Korg M50, Korg Karma, Yamaha Motif Xf6, Yamaha DX7, Novation K Station, Waldorf Blofeld, Siel DK80, cyclone analogic tt 303

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