Moog Delay and Tap Tempo

Anvil · Post by **Anvil** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 12:27 pm

I see that the Murf can work with a Tap Tempo switch. Is there a way to get the Delay pedal to work with one?

OysterRock · Post by **OysterRock** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 12:47 pm

Nope.

Rogue · Post by **Rogue** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 12:53 pm

I imagine if you have both 'foogers, you could connect them with their CV inputs / outputs. I'm guessing the "Rate" on the MuRF and the "Time"on the Delay.

OysterRock · Post by **OysterRock** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 1:11 pm

Spike wrote:I imagine if you have both 'foogers, you could connect them with their CV inputs / outputs. I'm guessing the "Rate" on the MuRF and the "Time"on the Delay.

This would not work. Inputing any sort of waveform into the TIME input will only modulate the delay time. You would need a DC voltage with the amplitude dependent on frequency.

I suppose someone could design and built a frequency-to-CV device or use a pitch-to-voltage converter to track a clock source, but someone taping their foot will not be a suitable frequency source to track to.

Anvil · Post by **Anvil** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 1:54 pm

Thats too bad. Why didnt they include a tap tempo function on this pedal if the Murph has one?

Diamond makes an analog delay with tap function so it can be done --

http://www.diamondpedals.com/products/memorylane.html

OysterRock · Post by **OysterRock** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 2:07 pm

The Diamond delay must be digitally contolled with an analog signal path. I don't think tap tempo is possible with an all analog delay. The MuRF is digitally contolled, too.

redeyeflight · Post by **redeyeflight** » Thu Nov 02, 2006 5:07 pm

I'll tell ya even better than a tap tempo footswitch for the moogerfooger delay is an expression pedal to control the delay time...way more fun than using a tap tempo, and you can make pich bending like sounds. I actually hook up two expression pedals to the delay so I have a pedal to control delay time and another to control the amount of repeats. I do like the tap tempo function on the line 6 delay pedal and because that pedal can do really long delay times (like more than a second) I think the tap tempo function is great but the moog analog delay has way shorter times and the expression pedal is great cause the dealy times dont have to be SO precise as they would be if they were longer and had to sync up perfectly with the tempo of the song. I think the moogerfooger analog delay and something like the line 6 delay are really two completely different beasts and that's why I use both of them because the moogerfooger is great for shorter trippy sounding delays and the line 6 is great for long prefrectly synced delays. So if you really want a delay with a tap tempo function I highly reccommend the Line 6 delay but I'll say it right now that it doesn't even come close to replicating the soudn of the moog delay.

OysterRock · Post by **OysterRock** » Thu Nov 02, 2006 7:26 pm

I ordered an MF-104Z on Wednesday, it gets here next week. God, I can't wait!

redeyeflight wrote:I think the moogerfooger analog delay and something like the line 6 delay are really two completely different beasts and that's why I use both of them...

I agree with you on this, there just two different beast with very different sounds and uses. I wish I hadn't sold my DL-4, the looping function was fun for jamming with myself. Also, the backward delay was cool. I hated those little recessed knobs, though! How the hell are you supposed to tweak those things?!

latigid on · Post by **latigid on** » Fri Nov 03, 2006 12:28 pm

I've got a 104SD and a Boss DD-20 (and an RE-150). Each have their own strengths; digital is good for precise delay time/crisp delay. Analog/tape is great for warm delay and tasteful feedback

eric coleridge · Post by **eric coleridge** » Sat Nov 04, 2006 2:39 am

So theres no way to sync up the Moog Analog Delay with an LFO or other timing signal?

That's very strange. I haven't ever played the Mooger Delay, but that seems like a pretty big ommission.

latigid on · Post by **latigid on** » Sat Nov 04, 2006 12:38 pm

Analog delays work on clock speeds up near the supersonic audio range. If you can tap your foot that fast, then good on you!

You would think a simple timer circuit, as Oyster says, could be made which converts time to voltage. So say, 345ms tap = 2.3V or whatever and this corresponds to 345ms on the delay. Due to the analog nature, this probably wouldn't be all that accurate.

The other option is to get a delay crankin' and get the rest of the band to sync. to you!

willi · Post by **willi** » Sun Nov 05, 2006 7:06 pm

Maybe I'm missing something, but the lack of a tap tempo on the 104z has been a bit of a peeve of mine and I have thought a little bit about a solution. Basically the only way around it is to have some MIDI device that takes in the tap tempo and deduces the BPM, then have that value sent to a MIDI-CV converter, which in turn sends CV to the 104z Time CV input. The upside to this is that you could have a single tap tempo sending regular tap tempo, MIDI tempo, and CV tempo... obvious downside is the need for extra gear (expense, space, weight)... ne?

It seems then that there should be at least a small niche market for such a device... single tap tempo input, split to multiple 1/4" tap tempo outputs, along with MIDI I/O (this would allow a synth to control the 'master tempo' as well as the footswitch), and CV output. It would also be cool if this device could take an audio input for BPM analysis...

The AdrenaLinn also has a delay that can be synched to tempo BTW.

Torin · Post by **Torin** » Wed Feb 27, 2008 10:04 pm

I could be wrong but I don't think that would work because the time imput on the mf-104 doesn't work the same way as the tap imput on the murf. I just finished building a midi2cv converter so today I ran some trials. You can certainly modulate the delay time which is cool, but so far no actual sync.... what I'm thinking is maybe if I use a pitch wheel or mod wheel output and map out what midi values represent what tempos... it wouldn't be perfect, but you could essentially get 127 different tempos via midi control... I think. I'll let you all know how it goes...
Also today I synced a keyboard to my freqbox freq IN so that I could play the oscillator on the keys, which was fun, but when I programmed a melody on a midi track in Pro Tools and fed that to it I got a steady (but not in time with the click) clicking noise, and the notes only played for a very short time, whereas on the keyboard the notes would play as long as you held the keys down.... anybody have any idea why?

ColorForm2113 · Post by **ColorForm2113** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 4:06 am

Torin wrote: Also today I synced a keyboard to my freqbox freq IN so that I could play the oscillator on the keys, which was fun, but when I programmed a melody on a midi track in Pro Tools and fed that to it I got a steady (but not in time with the click) clicking noise, and the notes only played for a very short time, whereas on the keyboard the notes would play as long as you held the keys down.... anybody have any idea why?

i had kinda the same problem when i first synced my micro moog to midi. it seemed despite the gate time it only sent the initial note trigger. so i had to just extend the VCA Release... seeing that the freqbox doesnt have a VCA, and i dont have a Freqbox to experiment with... i guess im not much help then am i lol...unless you find some way to extend the trigger signal. as for the unsynced click, my midi/cv converter has s-trig and v-trig outputs (i think they might have been labeled vice verca) but the s-trig is supposed to work with my micromoog. when connected to the "S", the cv note was triggered after the midi note was released. but when hooked up to the "V" they triggered at the same time. so it might be the type of converted you have. good luck

EricK · Post by **EricK** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 9:45 am

eric coleridge wrote:So theres no way to sync up the Moog Analog Delay with an LFO or other timing signal?

That's very strange. I haven't ever played the Mooger Delay, but that seems like a pretty big ommission.

Man I ordered my Delay last TUesday, it got here 2 days after that. After I got it I was like "Oh, crap I can't believe I spent almost 700 dollars on this thing."

But after I started seriously using it with some of my other instruments (the theremin is what did it for me) then I realized that it is a worthy investment.

EricK