MF-104MSD feedback insert

[Me Mushroom]

I managed to find a super delay last month and got it on lay away and brought it home the other day. After reading the manual, I'm still not super certain how to use the feedback insert plug in. Can anyone explain the ins-and-outs of this control in general. The last thing I want to do is accidentally give it an input that will damage the pedal. In particular, what kind of Moogerfooger outs can be incorporated with the feedback insert?

[c7sus]

Congrats on the score! The 104MSD is a great pedal.

The FB loop jack on the 104M's and 108M's is a TRS that requires an insert cable. It works just like an insert on a mixer. The "Tip" is the send and the "Ring" is the return. Any stompbox or rack effect will work as an insert. What the FB insert allows you to do is process the delayed portion of the audio signal and send the return back into the 104M ahead of the final audio outputs. The "dry" portion of the final audio output remains un-affected by whatever it is you have plugged into the insert, only the delayed portion gets processed.

For example, you could insert a 101 and have enveloped and/or darker echoes (or brighter depending on Resonance setting on the 101). I've used all of the MoogerFoogers at some time or another as insert effects with both the 104SD and the 104MSD. Be mindful of the input and output levels on the inserted effect to get the best signal/noise level.

Also, the FB loop is for AUDIO processing only, not CV's.

[Asymetrical]

I dont own this pedal so forgive my ignorance but.....

Don't you run the delay out to say a wah pedal and then the Wah out back to the Feedback insert?

Mix out to the mains......

or is there some kind of Y type cable you need to run out FB insert?

[c7sus]

I dont own this pedal so forgive my ignorance but.....

Don't you run the delay out to say a wah pedal and then the Wah out back to the Feedback insert?

Mix out to the mains......

or is there some kind of Y type cable you need to run out FB insert?

Yes, the feedback loop requires a Y cable.

The difference between using the feedback loop and using the main out is that only the portion of the signal that passes through the bucket chips is effected. Using the Mix knob you dial up the amount of dry vs wet signal which appears at the main (L) output. If using both outputs the effect in the feedback loop would only appear on the wet output.

[Vsyevolod]

Yes, the feedback loop requires a Y cable.

Yes, the feedback loop requires an insert cable (as explained above). When you say Y cable it could be taken the wrong way and yes you can damage your gear by sending two separate outputs into the unbuffered return. I understand what you're saying, just trying to use the correct nomenclature.

An insert cable uses the TRS end to plug into the 'FB Insert' jack on the back of the 104. You have to figure out which of the two TS cables on the other end are send or receive. Typically they are marked with 'send' and 'receive' tape, otherwise they are red for receive and black or grey for send.

And just because it uses a TRS cable, does not mean that the signal is balanced, it's not.

All in good understanding,

Stephen




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[c7sus]

I never thought of the "Y" term being misconstrued as a splitter, but when you put it that way it makes sense to use the term "Insert" instead.

[Me Mushroom]

Thank y'all so much for the info. I wondered if I would need a cable with 2 ends. And also the clarification on insert cable versus splitter. I am one that would have not taken note of the difference before it was too late . That being said, I want to make sure I understand this properly. If I were using the 101 for instance, I would plug the tip/ring end into the FB insert in the 104, and I would plug the send end of the insert cable into the audio in on the 101, and the recieve end of the insert cable into the audio out of the 101 right? So the FB insert is basically an effects loop plug in/out, but rather than having an in and also an out for the effects loop, the one plug both sends and receives. Do I have all that correct?

[Croyote]

1 - 1/4" TRS to 2 - 1/4" TS cables.

You can find the HOSA for like $5-$20 online, more if you want the Mogami one, which I have and love.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/3ft-MOGAMI-GOLD ... 35e9887c4f

[Stuka]

Thank y'all so much for the info. I wondered if I would need a cable with 2 ends. And also the clarification on insert cable versus splitter. I am one that would have not taken note of the difference before it was too late . That being said, I want to make sure I understand this properly. If I were using the 101 for instance, I would plug the tip/ring end into the FB insert in the 104, and I would plug the send end of the insert cable into the audio in on the 101, and the recieve end of the insert cable into the audio out of the 101 right? So the FB insert is basically an effects loop plug in/out, but rather than having an in and also an out for the effects loop, the one plug both sends and receives. Do I have all that correct?

Yes, that's how it works.