How And Where To Learn Sub37/Modulation

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Enkryption
Posts: 7
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2014 4:49 pm

How And Where To Learn Sub37/Modulation

Post by Enkryption » Sat Nov 22, 2014 12:29 pm

Hi All...

So I got my Sub 37 Awhile ago and been messing around. Got books and read tons of forums, yet nothing explains Exactly "How" To work this or any Synth...
I've read the Modulation Post on here but so many abbreviations and lack of detail on how to do it leaves me confused.

Its my first moog and I decided on this one because of its potential and history.. I was going to go for the Nord Stage 2 but wasn't what I wanted and concluded that if I have vst's why do I need a nord. So after months of research and waiting for the ups guy my Sub 37 came and do not regret my decision/purchase..

Sadly its just sitting here bc no matter how much I read or tweak around There are Zero Vids or step by step Examples explaining how to control it, use it.

It would be Amazing if some one here had a source for a tutorial or explain to me how the Mods and Sources work..

My Goals are... Plug my Guitar in to it, Dub Step Sound by having One LFO/OSC control the other with rate, Have Logic Pro set the BPM on it through usb Midi, Ect...

Also Getting the Kick,Snare,Hat Sounds out of it?? I was Looking at the Minitaur to add it to the Sub 37 bc from the video and examples it sounds amazing and that type of setup is what got me to want the Sub.. Being able to expand and control many devices..

Thank you for reading, Hope you guys can Help.

BorisYeltsin
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun Nov 09, 2014 6:23 am

Re: How And Where To Learn Sub37/Modulation

Post by BorisYeltsin » Sat Nov 22, 2014 5:00 pm

Turn on your Sub 37, hold down INIT-button, and start tweaking :D

Do you understand the chain of sound in synths? The raw and most basic sound comes from the oscillator. E.g. you can start with OSC 1 alone. (Mute or turn down the volume on SUB 1, OSC 2, NOISE and EXT). Now you can select OSC1's waveform by turning the button WAVE in the OSCILLATORS 1 section, you might adjust the octave as well if you feel like it. After that you can add LFO and filtering, and you can add SUB 1 or OSC 2 or NOISE or EXT. Or you can do something completely different, it's all up to you.

If you want to connect a guitar, I would think you first need to run the signal through some sort of guitar amp, and from the guitar amp's out into the AUDIO IN on the 37. On the 37 you need to hold down a note for any external sound to be heard, so you can press down the LATCH ON-button. If you want to only hear your guitar, mute OSC1, SUB 1, OSC2, and NOISE. Turn up the volume on EXT IN, you should hear your guitar. Now I guess you can add LFO and filter the guitar, at least the filter.

I'm not familiar with Logic, hopefully someone else can explain how you sync 37 with LOGIC.

BorisYeltsin
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun Nov 09, 2014 6:23 am

Re: How And Where To Learn Sub37/Modulation

Post by BorisYeltsin » Sat Nov 22, 2014 5:45 pm

Assuming you don't know any of this...

Press INIT. Mute/turn down anything except OSC1. What you hear is the raw, basic sound coming from oscillator 1. Try to adjust it's waveform, by turning WAVE-knob in OSCILLATORS 1 section. Try messing with filter; cutoff and resonance. Changes are happening.. but it's very basic.

As an example, you can control both the filter-cutoff and filter-resonance with LFO: Use e.g. MOD 1-section, (by default on the 37's INIT-presets, the MOD 1 section is routed to the MOD-wheel. To turn this routing off, press CONTROLLERS-button in the MOD 1-section, select MOD WHEEL and turn the FINE TUNE-knob to the middle to set the routing to OFF / 0 %. Press CONTROLLERS-button again to exit.)
Turn the cutoff all the way to the right, and the resonance all the way to the left. Now, turn the MOD 1 SOURCE-knob in the MOD 1-section all the way to the left. This sets the LFO source to a wave just like the one pictured on the 37. Now, turn the FILTER AMT-knob in the MOD 1-section all the way to the right. The LFO 1 is now controlling the cutoff, and you should hear a rytmic change. Turn the LFO 1 RATE-knob to decrease or increase the rate of the LFO controlling the filter-cutoff.
Turn the FILTER AMT-knob (in MOD 1 section) to zero, and turn on the PITCH AMT-knob next to it. The LFO 1 is now controlling the pitch. Mess around with RATE etc. Also, when you adjust e.g. FILTER AMT, it's impact on the cutoff will be relative to the position of the cutoff wheel. Try to experiment with different positions of both the cutoff-wheel and the FILTER AMT.

The LFO can be routed to many more things than just the filter and the pitch. Try messing around with MOD 1 / 2 AMT- knobs and the MOD 1 / 2- buttons. You can also press CONTROLLERS-button on both MOD 1 and MOD 2 section, scroll down to and select MOD 1 / 2 edit, and there select PROGRAM SOURCE AND PROGRAM DESTINATION. Think of what you want the LFO MOD to control and try routing it this way. Just be creative :D

A lot of this is covered in the manual, I believe..

Good luck, it's just fun. You can't do anything wrong :D
Last edited by BorisYeltsin on Sat Nov 22, 2014 5:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

MoogProg
Posts: 211
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2014 11:09 am

Re: How And Where To Learn Sub37/Modulation

Post by MoogProg » Sat Nov 22, 2014 5:49 pm

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/may99/a ... nthsec.htm

^This link is to Part 1 of a series that attempts to explain synthesis in general. Not sure it will specifically address your desired set-up, but surely it will get you started with understanding the functions of the Sub37. Good luck!

luczak
Posts: 35
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2014 10:44 am

Re: How And Where To Learn Sub37/Modulation

Post by luczak » Sun Nov 23, 2014 12:47 pm

Hello enkryption.
I am using the sub 37 with a nord stage 2. Pianos and organs from ns2 synth from sub 37.
The nord also allows me to use massive with sub 37 and it has the sample editor.
As regards the minitaur i traded mine in with a slim phatty to get the sub 37 as it seemed to do all they could and more.I am not quite sure how it happens but the bass seems to be thicker with the sub than the mini and the sub seems to have amazing volume capabilities.

c7sus
Posts: 468
Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2005 5:42 pm

Re: How And Where To Learn Sub37/Modulation

Post by c7sus » Sun Nov 23, 2014 12:58 pm

FTR DO NOT patch the output of a guitar amp into the "audio in" jack of any synth.

Use a line out off the amp if it has one, or get yourself a PRE-AMP.

You could even use the drive and output of any Moogerfooger as a signal boost.

As far as learning the functions on the Sub 37 just turn it on and start tweaking. Just about every single function has a knob or button to control it.

I think you are going to be disappointed at trying to get "dub step guitar" sounds via the external audio input. I have used my Voyager for processing guitar and while the effects are based around oscillators controlling each other and the filters the results are more like phase shifting, chorus, and ring modulation.

A really cool thing to do with an analog monosynth is stuff like Pete Townshend did way back when. Use external CV's to open the gate and control the filter to process external audio. The MuRF seems to be somewhat based around that idea.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O5voNyRmvXs

http://www.thewho.net/whotabs/gear/guitar/arp.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2jW9d3bbsYU
Voyager EB #165, T3 #292, MF-101, 102, 103, 104SD, 2x104MSD, 105M, 107, 108M, MP-201, VX-351, CP-251, Frostwave Fat Controller.

tebers
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Joined: Sun Jul 06, 2014 11:14 am

Re: How And Where To Learn Sub37/Modulation

Post by tebers » Sun Nov 23, 2014 4:31 pm

read the sub phatty manual. good description how sub works. with sub 37 you have one more mod and some more features on the env/amp section.

Asymetrical
Posts: 56
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Re: How And Where To Learn Sub37/Modulation

Post by Asymetrical » Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:01 pm

This series helped me tons.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLKiGwdMgig

I wish Moog would give this guy a Sub37 this year and have him explain the Arp and Sequence features like the step and Latch.....

I've still not messed with the Envelope features yet either as I'm not sure how to wrap my head around what I want out of using them like Multi Trigger and Latch and the shift features like delay and hold.

Anyway I'm just a bit shy as I don't have any good examples of why I'd want this feature to create whatever sound I'm playing. I'll discover things in time but a good Tut help tons, I still don't have a Sub37 manual either.

BorisYeltsin
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun Nov 09, 2014 6:23 am

Re: How And Where To Learn Sub37/Modulation

Post by BorisYeltsin » Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:24 pm

c7sus wrote:FTR DO NOT patch the output of a guitar amp into the "audio in" jack of any synth.
Why not?

Enkryption
Posts: 7
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2014 4:49 pm

Re: How And Where To Learn Sub37/Modulation

Post by Enkryption » Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:35 pm

HEllo...

Thanks guys for all the Great advice...

First thing I did when I got my Sub was do INT Patch lol, the problem was and IS not knowing how the chain of sound works and MOD Sources and how to use and select them.
Ive read everything on how OSC works and ASDR, EG.. (CV control still Eludes me) but its like reading a physics book ..

I was looking to produce a Dubstep sound that has that big grit Bass and speed up and slow it down.. I have got close using INT Patch but I want to know what I'm doing a little bit at least than just random guessing..

Another Sound I was dying to get is the CPU Thinking sound, That Bleep-Blepp Boop, Bop sound. I did it by complete accident one day and didn't save the Patch :(

Ya the Guitar has nothing to do with Dubstep lol, But I do want to plug it in. I have a Scarlet 2i2 Interface I can use to External IN instead of Direct from amp, I really don't even ever use an amp so Im good..

I will tweak around and try out what you guys wrote on here and do some more reading when I get some time and Keep you guys updated..

Want to say thanks Again for the Help this is a great community and very proud to be a new Moog Owner....!!

c7sus
Posts: 468
Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2005 5:42 pm

Re: How And Where To Learn Sub37/Modulation

Post by c7sus » Mon Nov 24, 2014 1:14 am

Because the outputs of many common amplifiers are POWER outputs designed to go to a speaker or a power soak/dummy load. Putting that signal through a synth would fry the input stage and likely fry the output transformer on the amp too.

A lot of modern amps have line outputs or sends and returns, and you could certainly patch a synth through those types of outs.
Voyager EB #165, T3 #292, MF-101, 102, 103, 104SD, 2x104MSD, 105M, 107, 108M, MP-201, VX-351, CP-251, Frostwave Fat Controller.

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breun
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Location: Utrecht, The Netherlands

Re: How And Where To Learn Sub37/Modulation

Post by breun » Mon Nov 24, 2014 7:26 am

Asymetrical wrote:I still don't have a Sub37 manual either.
You can download the PDF version here: http://www.moogmusic.com/products/phatt ... nloads-tab

JohanH211
Posts: 11
Joined: Sun Dec 01, 2013 8:07 am

Re: How And Where To Learn Sub37/Modulation

Post by JohanH211 » Fri Apr 22, 2016 9:38 am

I was looking for ways of modulation of the Sub 37, check out this youtube video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJZ17Wh ... xGcQ8kKYa4
This will get you sorted

Hans Olo
Posts: 3
Joined: Tue Feb 16, 2016 4:41 pm

Re: How And Where To Learn Sub37/Modulation

Post by Hans Olo » Mon Apr 25, 2016 8:15 am

I feel I did get a lot out of http://www.syntorial.com, maybe you'll find it useful, too. It's not exactly cheap, but you get to test drive a substantial part before you have to pay.

Best,
Hans
Sub 37 Mac OS X 10.11 Focusrite 18i20 Ableton Live 9.6

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