Sub Phatty Editor - beta test feeedback

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misterpete
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Re: Sub Phatty Editor - beta test feeedback

Post by misterpete » Sun Jun 23, 2013 11:59 am

YES ~ AS TIL POINTS OUT defaults are not remembered - so (at least on my machine) you have to reset the MIDI prefs to SUB PHATTY each time you open the Standalone or the Plug-in versions... then click something and wait for the "disconnected' message to go away — once you are connected the number of firmware version will appear above the editor version number
then you should be good to go

ul303 wrote:
misterpete wrote:yes i see the same message each time I load the program, until i reset prefs in the AU version too :D
ul303 wrote:Hardware disconnected error in VST version.

What do you mean exactly? Did you solve the issue? Can you explain?
Please Call Me, PETE
https://petedako.bandcamp.com/music
"Mr. Pete" at MuffWiggler |@petedako on Twitter

ul303
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Re: Sub Phatty Editor - beta test feeedback

Post by ul303 » Sun Jun 23, 2013 1:36 pm

misterpete wrote:YES ~ AS TIL POINTS OUT defaults are not remembered - so (at least on my machine) you have to reset the MIDI prefs to SUB PHATTY each time you open the Standalone or the Plug-in versions... then click something and wait for the "disconnected' message to go away — once you are connected the number of firmware version will appear above the editor version number
then you should be good to go


Sorry I don't get you, what do you mean exactly by "reset the MIDI prefs to SUB PHATTY"?

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till
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Re: Sub Phatty Editor - beta test feeedback

Post by till » Sun Jun 23, 2013 4:12 pm

* The standalone program icon on the Mac is the famous "Moog note". This is good looking, but somehow it is not descriptive at all, as it is just indicating Moog. And this could also suite to other Moog editors like the Minitaur or the Voyager. So maybe an icon with a SubPhatty reference like the Minitaur editor icon with the bull would be more suitable.
keep on turning these Moog knobs

Sequence:
Prodigy * minimoog '79 * Voyager * MF102 * MF103 * MF104z * MP201 * Taurus 3 * Minitaur * Sub Phatty * MF105 * Minimoog 2017+ MUSE * One 16

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misterpete
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Re: Sub Phatty Editor - beta test feeedback

Post by misterpete » Sun Jun 23, 2013 7:07 pm

reselect "SUB PHATTY" in the MIDI Input/Output pop up/pull down menus at top of the editor prefs page
Sorry I don't get you, what do you mean exactly by "reset the MIDI prefs to SUB PHATTY"?
Please Call Me, PETE
https://petedako.bandcamp.com/music
"Mr. Pete" at MuffWiggler |@petedako on Twitter

Rokatansky
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Re: Sub Phatty Editor - beta test feeedback

Post by Rokatansky » Sun Jun 23, 2013 7:46 pm

Standalone 64 or 32 shows "Hardware disconnected" nevertheless turning the editor parameters affects the Sub Phatty and vice versa from Sub Phatty to editor as long as Sub Phatty is selected as In and Out.
None of my Keyboard controllers works on the editor no matter USB or DIN.
VST crashes Cubase 7 normal or JBridged.


Windows 7 64 Ultimate
Cubase 7.0.4 64
Novation Remote SL

ul303
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Re: Sub Phatty Editor - beta test feeedback

Post by ul303 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 2:01 pm

misterpete wrote:reselect "SUB PHATTY" in the MIDI Input/Output pop up/pull down menus at top of the editor prefs page
Sorry I don't get you, what do you mean exactly by "reset the MIDI prefs to SUB PHATTY"?

OK thanks. This does not work for me :(

Amos
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Re: Sub Phatty Editor - beta test feeedback

Post by Amos » Mon Jun 24, 2013 3:27 pm

ul303 wrote:Not sure if this is a bug but presets are saved as 1-1.syx to 4-4.syx so you are limited to 16 presets per folder otherwise drag and drop of presets from one folder to another one will overwrite all the presets but the latest 1-1 to 4-4 ones!


This should be fixed in v0.9.3... now when you drag presets from your hardware to the preset library, the filenames are not 1-1, 1-2.syx etc., but instead the files are named according to the preset name. So, if the presets are still (no name) in the hardware, rename them first, then drag into the user library. This will create .syx files with meaningful names.

ul303
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Re: Sub Phatty Editor - beta test feeedback

Post by ul303 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 3:59 pm

Amos wrote:
ul303 wrote:Not sure if this is a bug but presets are saved as 1-1.syx to 4-4.syx so you are limited to 16 presets per folder otherwise drag and drop of presets from one folder to another one will overwrite all the presets but the latest 1-1 to 4-4 ones!


This should be fixed in v0.9.3... now when you drag presets from your hardware to the preset library, the filenames are not 1-1, 1-2.syx etc., but instead the files are named according to the preset name. So, if the presets are still (no name) in the hardware, rename them first, then drag into the user library. This will create .syx files with meaningful names.


OK thanks. Just the way of managing presets, not a big issue if you use the editor you can save it to its name. Just an issue with older presets saved with the sysex import tool.

Any thoughts on the hardware disconnected issue?
VST 0.93 does not solve the issue. What does the MidiPortHandler program do?

Amos
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Re: Sub Phatty Editor - beta test feeedback

Post by Amos » Mon Jun 24, 2013 4:17 pm

ul303 wrote:Any thoughts on the hardware disconnected issue?
VST 0.93 does not solve the issue. What does the MidiPortHandler program do?


I wrote some instructions already which mention this; I'll cut and paste them here:

For the Windows VST plugin: this plugin uses a special background application [MidiPortHandler] to open a direct MIDI connection to your hardware, outside of the plugin host application (your DAW). Because windows is not good about sharing MIDI devices between programs, this means that you can't select the same MIDI device inside your DAW.

The reason it works this way is because the VST standard can't pass SysEx data, which is how the Sub Phatty sends and receives preset files and global data. So, in order to manage presets on the Sub PHatty from within a DAW, a separate MIDI connection outside the DAW is needed. One way to manage this is to use the Sub Phatty USB connection for communication with the Editor plugin, and the Sub Phatty standard MIDI connectors and a separate MIDI interface to connect the Sub Phatty to your DAW. Or vice versa (USB for the DAW, standard MIDI for the editor plugin).


So, the "disconnected" message is saying that the plugin is not getting a proper response from the hardware, and the proper response is some sysex data... so, it sounds like you are getting MIDI CC data back and forth (the knobs turning) but not sysex data (disconnected message).

suggestions: de-select all MIDI devices from your DAW. So, DAW is not talking to any MIDI devices... then, go into "preferences" in the editor VST, and select Sub Phatty (USB connection to your sub phatty) for input and output device. Do you get any error message? Do you get the Sub Phatty firmware version number displayed in the lower left of Preferences?

ul303
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Re: Sub Phatty Editor - beta test feeedback

Post by ul303 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 4:47 pm

Amos wrote:
So, the "disconnected" message is saying that the plugin is not getting a proper response from the hardware, and the proper response is some sysex data... so, it sounds like you are getting MIDI CC data back and forth (the knobs turning) but not sysex data (disconnected message).


OK so the issue comes from sysex data.

Amos wrote:suggestions: de-select all MIDI devices from your DAW. So, DAW is not talking to any MIDI devices... then, go into "preferences" in the editor VST, and select Sub Phatty (USB connection to your sub phatty) for input and output device. Do you get any error message? Do you get the Sub Phatty firmware version number displayed in the lower left of Preferences?


Nope...still "Hardware Disconnected", no firmware version displayed.
As it works fine with the standalone version (that does not seem to use the MidiPortHandler application could it be an issue with this one? Anything related to Ableton not dealing with sysex?

JohnWynberg
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Re: Sub Phatty Editor - beta test feeedback

Post by JohnWynberg » Mon Jun 24, 2013 7:27 pm

JohnWynberg wrote:Logic 9 Pro in 64-bit mode fails to recognise the Sub Phatty Editor. [Edit: Actually, it also fails validation in 32-bit mode. But it works fine in Live 9 in 64-bit mode. So maybe the problem is with Logic 9. I have version 9.1.8]


Loaded version 0.93 of the Editor without problems in Logic. However, I might have had the Sub Phatty on the first time I tried to open Logic after installing the Editot.

Haven't had much time to test it today, but when I record the MIDI using External Instrument there is always a delay in relation to the audio. The MIDI clip starts a few seconds after the audio clip. And when I play back the MIDI, the first notes don't sound. (I think there was a discussion about this problem in relation to Ableton Live, but so far when I use the Sub Phatty as a MIDI controller, I never had that problem).

Also, when I turn some knobs, I can see my movements are recorded in the MIDI clip, but when I go to see the automations (and there is a long list of parameters to automate, with the editor loaded), they don't appear to have been recorded. Only the last value is displayed. I tried also with Ableton Live, and though I can hear some recorded automation, I cannot see it. I say some, I'm under the impression, since if I compare the recorded audio against the recorded MIDI, it sounds different.

Anyway, I wasn't very systematic in my approach. I'll try again tomorrow.

Rokatansky
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Re: Sub Phatty Editor - beta test feeedback

Post by Rokatansky » Mon Jun 24, 2013 9:02 pm

"For Windows, we now have 64-bit versions of the plugins for you to test…

http://www.moogconnect.net/downloads/su ... INS-PC_093"

None of them works on Cubase 7.0.4 64
64 version shows the Editor GUI after 2 or 3 minutes and then Cubase freezes.


Regards

HumanByDesign
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Re: Sub Phatty Editor - beta test feeedback

Post by HumanByDesign » Tue Jun 25, 2013 2:13 am

Mac OS 10.8.4
Logic Express 9.1.8
64bit
Sub P. Firmware 1.2.7
Editor ver. 0.9.3
MIDI via USB

First Impressions. Over all editor is quite good as a start. Looks nice aesthetically. Now to the Meat…..

Sub Phatty StandaloneEditor:

Silly hanging note issue keeps appearing intermittently when starting up editor.

Found I have to press the pref button first before anything can be sent to Sub P. Not retaining Midi input/output port. (And this is after making sure that the "Moog Sub Phatty" Midi port has activated in the Apple Midi Studio utility.)

Many problems with saving a patch and name displaying correctly.
After patch selction by name, display says (no name) and patch not changed.
When renaming a patch (no name) shows, but right clicking on (no name) displays the new name you just gave it. Saving patch and loading again shows the new name, but (no name) still shows in drop down list. Same happens in Librarian mode. There seems to be more of a problem if you have made the patch on the synth and try to import it to editor.

Clicking on the filter poles sometimes misses. Maybe a larger region to click on?


Plug-in mode:

Many problems to get plug in to work at all.

While playing/depressing a note on keyboard, if you pitchbend down the note will get stuck and Logic will crash. This is unique to the Sub P plug-in. Haven't experience this ever.

When in plug-in mode, if plug-in window is open and you try to change its insert slot to no plugin Logic will crash.

Velocity dead zone? I've noticed with the plug-in that there is a rather large dead zone for velocity. I looked in the pref panel and found that it defaults to 32 levels of velocity. I bumped it up to 127 with no effect. even turned up the Vel to Vol knob.


Feature Requests:

Needs a button or way for a blank initilized patch that can be sent to the moog immediately.

A DROPDOWN LIST OF ALL THE HIDDEN FUNCTIONS TO SELECT FROM WOULD BE GREATLY APPRECIATED. INSTEAD OF HAVING TO REMEMBER WHICH DOT COMBINATION IS WHICH. I know there are many on the editor panel, but all of them would be convenient.

Small Keyboard and/or arpeggiator/hold button. So sounds will play while editing with mouse.

After thought: Given the Sub P's diminutive size maybe an editor that looks just like the synth would be more familiar; with the all the extras of course as pop out panels. I was put off a little at having to search for the new locations of things like the volume knob and octave buttons (which don't exist) I don't like where the volume knob has been moved to or that the octave buttons have been removed and relegated to the numerical drop down under the wheel. I would prefer it laid out just like the actual panel with everything else on the secondary panel. After you get your head around the physical synth and then go to an editor with a different layout it seems somewhat counter intuitive.

barryfell
Posts: 73
Joined: Sat Apr 06, 2013 5:10 am

Re: Sub Phatty Editor - beta test feeedback

Post by barryfell » Wed Jun 26, 2013 6:52 am

misterpete wrote:YES ~ AS TIL POINTS OUT defaults are not remembered - so (at least on my machine) you have to reset the MIDI prefs to SUB PHATTY each time you open the Standalone or the Plug-in versions... then click something and wait for the "disconnected' message to go away — once you are connected the number of firmware version will appear above the editor version number
then you should be good to go

ul303 wrote:
misterpete wrote:yes i see the same message each time I load the program, until i reset prefs in the AU version too :D
ul303 wrote:Hardware disconnected error in VST version.

What do you mean exactly? Did you solve the issue? Can you explain?


I don't have this issue. Everything stays set up correctly from the first time I used it. (Windows 8 x64).

barryfell
Posts: 73
Joined: Sat Apr 06, 2013 5:10 am

Re: Sub Phatty Editor - beta test feeedback

Post by barryfell » Wed Jun 26, 2013 6:56 am

Rokatansky wrote:Standalone 64 or 32 shows "Hardware disconnected" nevertheless turning the editor parameters affects the Sub Phatty and vice versa from Sub Phatty to editor as long as Sub Phatty is selected as In and Out.
None of my Keyboard controllers works on the editor no matter USB or DIN.
VST crashes Cubase 7 normal or JBridged.

Windows 7 64 Ultimate
Cubase 7.0.4 64
Novation Remote SL


I've not had any hardware disconnected issues, crashes, and all my controllers work no problem when using the editor in a DAW (Win x64 Live x64).

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