Reissue Model D Midi issue

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jsharpphoto
Posts: 443
Joined: Sun Jul 05, 2015 4:18 pm

Reissue Model D Midi issue

Post by jsharpphoto » Fri Aug 23, 2019 11:05 pm

I'm pulling my hair out.

I have a reissue model D. My ideal setup would be:

Synth with local control off > midi out into Ableton live > Ableton midi track using the model D as a keyboard/midi to the model D > audio from synth to my interface.

The reasoning for treating the keyboard and synth separately, is to use Ableton's arpeggiator/midi scales/etc and to record midi clips. I know I can record midi clips without turning local control off, but using the midi arpeggiator with local turned on creates a less than desirable real-time experience.

Here's where things are hanging up.
With local control off - I can record a clip but not hear the synth. If I play the clip back, I CAN hear the synth. So I know that the midi connections are correct, or it wouldn't properly record or playback. IT JUST ISN"T SENDING THROUGH IN REAL TIME. and I can't hear the synth while I record. It's madness.

I even tried to bypass Ableton all together, and just connect the midi out of the synth to the midi input of the synth, and I get no sound.

So what I can tell is that with local control off, it's somehow cancelling out the incoming midi signal.

To recap. With local control off, I can record midi from the keyboard, and send midi to the synth, but I can't do both at the same time?

I am up to date on firmware.
Moog Format Modular
Model D (2016)
Moog Subsequent37
Oberheim OB-6
Sequential Rev2

Minimooger
Posts: 16
Joined: Thu Apr 27, 2017 4:31 pm

Re: Reissue Model D Midi issue

Post by Minimooger » Thu Sep 12, 2019 11:02 am

that does not work because the local off implementation in the mini reissue is fishy . however there are modifications on the market which do a great leapfrog in terms of midi for the mini .

jsharpphoto
Posts: 443
Joined: Sun Jul 05, 2015 4:18 pm

Re: Reissue Model D Midi issue

Post by jsharpphoto » Thu Jun 25, 2020 12:04 am

Update:

I finally was able to get the new “keyboard scan” pcb that Moog sold me ($82). No change to the issue. If I have ableton taking midi FROM the synth, with midi local off, and processing the midi data (ableton native arpeggiator) and sending the midi BACK to the synth, I don’t hear the arpeggiator (even though I can see the midi out activity light flashing the arp rate while I hold the keys down. If I do everything the same way, but use any other midi keyboard in the studio to play the Arpeggiator, the D triggers via the Arp exactly how it should.
Moog Format Modular
Model D (2016)
Moog Subsequent37
Oberheim OB-6
Sequential Rev2

jsharpphoto
Posts: 443
Joined: Sun Jul 05, 2015 4:18 pm

Re: Reissue Model D Midi issue

Post by jsharpphoto » Thu Jun 25, 2020 12:06 am

Minimooger wrote: Thu Sep 12, 2019 11:02 am that does not work because the local off implementation in the mini reissue is fishy . however there are modifications on the market which do a great leapfrog in terms of midi for the mini .
Can you elaborate on that?
Moog Format Modular
Model D (2016)
Moog Subsequent37
Oberheim OB-6
Sequential Rev2

jsharpphoto
Posts: 443
Joined: Sun Jul 05, 2015 4:18 pm

Re: Reissue Model D Midi issue

Post by jsharpphoto » Thu Jun 25, 2020 12:17 am

It also sometimes retriggers the note when I left my finger off the key. I think incorrect note-off messages might be causing these issues.
Moog Format Modular
Model D (2016)
Moog Subsequent37
Oberheim OB-6
Sequential Rev2

rolfmeurer
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue Mar 26, 2024 1:05 pm

Re: Reissue Model D Midi issue

Post by rolfmeurer » Tue Mar 26, 2024 1:23 pm

How to use the Model-D Reissue as a master keyboard in a DAW MIDI setup. R.Meurer 240326
Here are the steps:
1. Global Settings: Set MIDI Local Off
• Hold down the highest three black keys (F#3, G#3, A#3) while turning on the power.
2. Legato Triggering Power-On Commands: Set Multi-Trigger On
• Hold the D Major chord (D3, F#3, A3) while turning on the power.
3. Note Priority Power-On Commands: Set Last Note Priority
• Hold the C Major chord (C3, E3, G3) while turning on the power.
4. Gate Source Power-On Commands: Set Gate Source to External, MIDI, and Local Keys (All)
• Hold down F2 and C3 simultaneously while turning on the power.

kindest regards Rolf Meurer KRAFTWERK (mLab.midisoft.de)
jsharpphoto wrote: Fri Aug 23, 2019 11:05 pm I'm pulling my hair out.

I have a reissue model D. My ideal setup would be:

Synth with local control off > midi out into Ableton live > Ableton midi track using the model D as a keyboard/midi to the model D > audio from synth to my interface.

The reasoning for treating the keyboard and synth separately, is to use Ableton's arpeggiator/midi scales/etc and to record midi clips. I know I can record midi clips without turning local control off, but using the midi arpeggiator with local turned on creates a less than desirable real-time experience.

Here's where things are hanging up.
With local control off - I can record a clip but not hear the synth. If I play the clip back, I CAN hear the synth. So I know that the midi connections are correct, or it wouldn't properly record or playback. IT JUST ISN"T SENDING THROUGH IN REAL TIME. and I can't hear the synth while I record. It's madness.

I even tried to bypass Ableton all together, and just connect the midi out of the synth to the midi input of the synth, and I get no sound.

So what I can tell is that with local control off, it's somehow cancelling out the incoming midi signal.

To recap. With local control off, I can record midi from the keyboard, and send midi to the synth, but I can't do both at the same time?

I am up to date on firmware.

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till
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Re: Reissue Model D Midi issue

Post by till » Wed Mar 27, 2024 2:02 am

jsharpphoto wrote: Thu Jun 25, 2020 12:17 am It also sometimes retriggers the note when I left my finger off the key. I think incorrect note-off messages might be causing these issues.
Why should there be incorrect MIDI note-off messages?
I would check for a MIDI loop.
keep on turning these Moog knobs

Sequence:
Prodigy * minimoog '79 * Voyager * MF102 * MF103 * MF104z * MP201 * Taurus 3 * Minitaur * Sub Phatty * MF105 * Minimoog 2017+ MUSE * One 16

rolfmeurer
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Re: Reissue Model D Midi issue

Post by rolfmeurer » Wed Mar 27, 2024 7:24 am

The format for a Note Off message (using status byte 0x80) is typically:
0x80, nn, vv, where nn represents the note number and vv represents the velocity (or release velocity in this case).

The format for a Note On message with velocity set to zero (which effectively serves as a Note Off message) would be: 0x90, nn, 00, where nn represents the note number.

the model-D keyboard is sending Note Off messages using the format
0x80, nn, vv instead of the more conventional 0x90, nn, 00.

As long as the receiving MIDI device properly interprets the messages,
either method should work.

kindest regards Rolf Meurer KRAFTWERK (mLab.midisoft.de)




till wrote: Wed Mar 27, 2024 2:02 am
jsharpphoto wrote: Thu Jun 25, 2020 12:17 am It also sometimes retriggers the note when I left my finger off the key. I think incorrect note-off messages might be causing these issues.
Why should there be incorrect MIDI note-off messages?
I would check for a MIDI loop.

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