Gaze into my Minimoog Power Supply crystal ball...

Tips and techniques for Minimoog Analog Synthesizers
Blackout
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Gaze into my Minimoog Power Supply crystal ball...

Post by Blackout » Sun Oct 30, 2016 9:36 am

Am i the only one that took one look at that external power supply that was supplied with their new Minimoog and said out loud "great...i give that thing a lifespan of exactly 2 months past warranty."

custom unique power supply, with its custom looking cable attachment/pins, and completely sealed so it cant be repaired...you rekkon its going to be running in 40 years like the supplies in the original minis?

heres what i should do...buy a whole carton of these sukkers right now, throw them up in the attic and wait until the minimoog is deleted by Moog in the next 18 months -2 years and then just sit back and wait for the poor bastards to start screaming when all those caps start popping in these unique multi-voltage power supplies, and then here i am with my new Ebay shop offering "original Minimoog PS" for $500 bucks...a bargain if you want the real Moog PS, after all its the only one that makes the mini sound "right" and doesnt introduce all that other noise, right? so you gotta get the original branded ones so you will PAY.

call me cynical. Or an opportunist. or just really worried for my minis lifespan with one lowly external black power lead "lump"...im already scared.

EricK
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Re: Gaze into my Minimoog Power Supply crystal ball...

Post by EricK » Sun Oct 30, 2016 10:28 am

You just foiled your attempt to corner the market. Everyone is now ordering multiple power supplies. My crystal ball shows your stock has tanked. :D
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Blackout
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Re: Gaze into my Minimoog Power Supply crystal ball...

Post by Blackout » Sun Oct 30, 2016 5:56 pm

i didnt really want to corner the market. i wanted everyone to think about it and order their own spare power supplies now. And demonstrate how problematic these cable warts are going to be....

sunny pedaal
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Re: Gaze into my Minimoog Power Supply crystal ball...

Post by sunny pedaal » Wed Nov 02, 2016 7:02 pm

It needs such an exclusive voltages ?

drxcm
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Re: Gaze into my Minimoog Power Supply crystal ball...

Post by drxcm » Fri Nov 04, 2016 4:26 pm

The supply is custom in that it provides +15V, -15V and +5V in separate pins - so the only way to replace it is buy a new original Moog supply, or use something like the same connector wired to a DotCom power supply which supplies similar voltages for large format modulars.

drxcm
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Re: Gaze into my Minimoog Power Supply crystal ball...

Post by drxcm » Fri Nov 04, 2016 4:44 pm

Blackout wrote:custom looking cable attachment/pins,


Looks like a 4-pin XLR connector - I think these are readily available.. https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/ ... emale.html

Blackout
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Re: Gaze into my Minimoog Power Supply crystal ball...

Post by Blackout » Sun Nov 20, 2016 2:11 pm

Are the Minimoog Power supplies available to be purchased separately from Moog? how much to they cost?

Blackout
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Re: Gaze into my Minimoog Power Supply crystal ball...

Post by Blackout » Tue Feb 14, 2017 1:16 pm

heres the problem i see with the way Moog have done things with the re-issue and the power supply.

In the original Moog, when you switched the front power button "OFF" , it dis-engaged the power supply and its caps...ie it turned the synth and its power supply off. This saves the capacitors and the power supply circuit from running when not in use. This is why so many Minis are still working and soldering on 30 or 40 years later with the original power supplies, transistors and capacitors. Use your mini for 2 hours a day? the wear and tear on your moog internal power supply is 14 hours worth a week.

in comparison, with the new Mini, the external wart power supply scenario is "always on" regardless of whether the "ON" switch on the Mini is turned or not. Use your new Mini for 2 hours a day? the wear and tear on your moog power supply is 168 hours a week. WHAT??? That little green light on the PS brick is always glowing, the caps inside are constantly charged and being pumped 24/7 regardless of whether power is being drawn by the kbd. Do you think this setup is going to be still working 30 or 40 years down the track? Honestly Moog were you really thinking about the future here? so short-sighted. Unless you are purposely looking forward to wringing all of us for 6 or 7 power supplies in our lifetime. Maybe that was the plan. Build a synth that will last 40 or 50 years with a PS setup that will last 4 or 5?

The only way to get the same life out of your mini and its PS as the original Mini is to reach down and behind your keyboard stand without spilling your beer or doing your back in, and switch it off at the wall socket every time you use it...thus turning off the power supply along with the synth. Like you used to be able to do on the original Mini from the front panel switch.

Are you going to bend down every time? not likely.

The crystal ball is glowing strongly on this one my friends...prepare for the inevitable.

Oh...and Moog....SHAME on you.

captainkidd
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Re: Gaze into my Minimoog Power Supply crystal ball...

Post by captainkidd » Tue Feb 14, 2017 3:09 pm

Blackout wrote:The only way to get the same life out of your mini and its PS as the original Mini is to reach down and behind your keyboard stand without spilling your beer or doing your back in, and switch it off at the wall socket every time you use it...thus turning off the power supply along with the synth. Like you used to be able to do on the original Mini from the front panel switch.

Are you going to bend down every time? not likely.



Right now I actually have mine plugged into a small power strip with a switch on it. So I can actually flip it off with my toe (I don't wear shoes in the house) so that helps. Other than the fact I've forgotten to flip it off a couple of times and had it on for a day or so. I am going to eventually get all my power bleep fest arranged so I don't have a million cords and strips all over but I will set it up so I can turn off the power to the synths completely.

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bichuelo
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Re: Gaze into my Minimoog Power Supply crystal ball...

Post by bichuelo » Tue Feb 14, 2017 3:49 pm

captainkidd wrote:
Blackout wrote:The only way to get the same life out of your mini and its PS as the original Mini is to reach down and behind your keyboard stand without spilling your beer or doing your back in, and switch it off at the wall socket every time you use it...thus turning off the power supply along with the synth. Like you used to be able to do on the original Mini from the front panel switch.

Are you going to bend down every time? not likely.



Right now I actually have mine plugged into a small power strip with a switch on it. So I can actually flip it off with my toe (I don't wear shoes in the house) so that helps. Other than the fact I've forgotten to flip it off a couple of times and had it on for a day or so. I am going to eventually get all my power bleep fest arranged so I don't have a million cords and strips all over but I will set it up so I can turn off the power to the synths completely.


I do something similar as well. It works fine.
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bichuelo
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Re: Gaze into my Minimoog Power Supply crystal ball...

Post by bichuelo » Tue Feb 14, 2017 3:56 pm

I don't think Moog will stop providing replacement parts for discontinued products easily.

They still have MP201 parts and they are plans for updating Taurus III firmware. They have sold me parts for the Voyager just a couple of months ago and the guys from their tech support have told me they plan to support the current generation of products for a lifetime.

I don't find Blackout's arguments quite valid, with all due respect.

If there is a design flaw in the PSU, I am sure they will make a new version which can be repaired, and even with an independent power switch.
http://audiotecna.info
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Blackout
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Re: Gaze into my Minimoog Power Supply crystal ball...

Post by Blackout » Wed Feb 15, 2017 5:31 am

bichuelo wrote:
captainkidd wrote:
Blackout wrote:The only way to get the same life out of your mini and its PS as the original Mini is to reach down and behind your keyboard stand without spilling your beer or doing your back in, and switch it off at the wall socket every time you use it...thus turning off the power supply along with the synth. Like you used to be able to do on the original Mini from the front panel switch.

Are you going to bend down every time? not likely.



Right now I actually have mine plugged into a small power strip with a switch on it. So I can actually flip it off with my toe (I don't wear shoes in the house) so that helps. Other than the fact I've forgotten to flip it off a couple of times and had it on for a day or so. I am going to eventually get all my power bleep fest arranged so I don't have a million cords and strips all over but I will set it up so I can turn off the power to the synths completely.


I do something similar as well. It works fine.


yep this is definately the way around the problem. But you need to be aware of the problem first to do this. I have a feeling a *lott* of people wont realize it.

Blackout
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Re: Gaze into my Minimoog Power Supply crystal ball...

Post by Blackout » Wed Feb 15, 2017 5:41 am

bichuelo wrote:I don't think Moog will stop providing replacement parts for discontinued products easily.

They still have MP201 parts and they are plans for updating Taurus III firmware. They have sold me parts for the Voyager just a couple of months ago and the guys from their tech support have told me they plan to support the current generation of products for a lifetime.

I don't find Blackout's arguments quite valid, with all due respect.

If there is a design flaw in the PSU, I am sure they will make a new version which can be repaired, and even with an independent power switch.


i find your supporting arguments quite invalid and irrelevant. You are suggesting that because Moog will possibly not discontinue the power supply as a spare part anytime soon (do you have any confirmation of this?) then its just fine to expect them to blow from normal wear and tear of running constantly and replace them every few years, instead of a change of caps in the original Mini PS once every 30 years or so...because...theres plenty of spares?

No-one is suggesting that there is a specific "design flaw" in the PSU. But unless you are suggesting that the new wall-wart PSU will run full time, 24/7 for the next 30 years, then you must admit that the new mini will not be around and working "as sold" for as long as the original.

Technology has come a long way and its probably fair to assume that the new PS is actually better and MORE RELIABLE than the components in the original! But that all gets thrown out the window when you compare 14 hours a week of running time vs 168 hours a week.

Unless, of course, you switch off Mini at the wall.

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bichuelo
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Re: Gaze into my Minimoog Power Supply crystal ball...

Post by bichuelo » Wed Feb 15, 2017 9:14 pm

Blackout wrote:
bichuelo wrote:I don't think Moog will stop providing replacement parts for discontinued products easily.

They still have MP201 parts and they are plans for updating Taurus III firmware. They have sold me parts for the Voyager just a couple of months ago and the guys from their tech support have told me they plan to support the current generation of products for a lifetime.

I don't find Blackout's arguments quite valid, with all due respect.

If there is a design flaw in the PSU, I am sure they will make a new version which can be repaired, and even with an independent power switch.


i find your supporting arguments quite invalid and irrelevant. You are suggesting that because Moog will possibly not discontinue the power supply as a spare part anytime soon (do you have any confirmation of this?) then its just fine to expect them to blow from normal wear and tear of running constantly and replace them every few years, instead of a change of caps in the original Mini PS once every 30 years or so...because...theres plenty of spares?

No-one is suggesting that there is a specific "design flaw" in the PSU. But unless you are suggesting that the new wall-wart PSU will run full time, 24/7 for the next 30 years, then you must admit that the new mini will not be around and working "as sold" for as long as the original.

Technology has come a long way and its probably fair to assume that the new PS is actually better and MORE RELIABLE than the components in the original! But that all gets thrown out the window when you compare 14 hours a week of running time vs 168 hours a week.

Unless, of course, you switch off Mini at the wall.


You shouldn't judge so easily.

I work servicing Moog gear as well as being a dealer for Colombia, and I am in constant contact with both management and tech support.

If I tell you that they will make a revision and a new version of the PSU if there is a design flaw, its because they will.

The accessories and spare parts are still available for discontinued products, and they have told me they are willing to have them for as long as people use their products. They have also told me personally they want their products to be used for a lifetime.

I don't know the technical details but I saw they explained to you on GS what could be the real drawbacks for this PS. I don't expect it to fail, but if it does, I will receive the instructions directly on how to service it.

I am not making this up.
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facon
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Re: Gaze into my Minimoog Power Supply crystal ball...

Post by facon » Wed Feb 22, 2017 10:33 pm

This is really blown out of proportion. Any negatives to the external power supply are overshadowed by the benefits. They used a standard 4 pin xlr instead of a custom connector. It'll always be pretty easy to find a +\-15v, 5V psu, even if you need to get one custom made.

If you're worried about wear on the psu, unplug it or use a power strip. Caps wear out more quickly when they are not used.

You'll find that a large portion of high end studio gear uses external PSUs. I wouldn't hesitate to own any of it simply because of an external psu.

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