Voyager Midi timing feels a little out compared to LP2

Tips and techniques for Minimoog Analog Synthesizers
David Bulog
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Voyager Midi timing feels a little out compared to LP2

Post by David Bulog » Sat Dec 25, 2010 4:25 am

My new Voyager Eclectic Blue (purchased used--its around 5 years old 128 preset model) is a great great lead instrument to play but the midi timing on the Voyager is all over the place
--its not tight-its totally unusable as a bass machine sequenced from a DAW--Im really surprised how bad it is compared to the Little Phatty Stage 2 --I think the USB is the key to super tight midi on the stage 2--its incredible!
Dont get me wrong the midi works fine technically but it just feels like a sloppy implementation timing wise--I just cannot use it
Can anyone point me the right direction if there could be a software update that improves the midi timing on the Voyager--its a long shot--failing that Im going to try a Kenton USB solo as a possible solution which has quite a fast midi to CV
thanks in advance
and Merry Christmas
Dave

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Prime NL
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Re: Voyager Midi timing feels a little out compared to LP2

Post by Prime NL » Sat Dec 25, 2010 8:14 am

First question i would like to ask is...what software version are you running right now on your Voyager...?

David Bulog
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Re: Voyager Midi timing feels a little out compared to LP2

Post by David Bulog » Sat Dec 25, 2010 6:26 pm

system version 3.4
however it has not got the upgrade board (At least I think it has not ) its the original 128 program version

Wendals
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Re: Voyager Midi timing feels a little out compared to LP2

Post by Wendals » Thu Jan 20, 2011 7:11 pm

Hey yo how are you connecting your Voyager with midi? Is it comming from your firewire sound card? If so i had the same problem. I had a firewire sound card that had Midi in-out connection and I would control my voyager through that from ableton with really bad timing issues. Like you said USB seems to be rock solid so I connected my voyager from my MIDI keyboard that has MIDI in out and the problem was completely fixed.

David Bulog
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Re: Voyager Midi timing feels a little out compared to LP2

Post by David Bulog » Fri Jan 21, 2011 6:58 pm

Im using a MOTU microlight USB -Midi with OSX
My gut feeling is that the midi circuit in the Voyager is not as fast as the LP2's and the Voyager will be much faster over CV/Gate in
However Im thinking of dumping the MOTU and using my kenton USB Solo midi to CV and using the Voyagers CV/gate in instead

Update--Using the Kenton USB Solo USD-CV convertor all my timing problems have disappeared
I have concluded that the midi circuit in the Voyager is sloppy and CV/Gate Ins is the best way to go
Tip Kenton user manual says this

It may be that your synth is slightly out of tune, so it will be necessary to adjust the USB SOLO to compensate for the tuning of your synth.
1, Firstly, ensure that your analogue synth is as in-tune as possible when playing from its own keyboard. Do this by adjusting the tuning or pitch knob on your analogue synth whilst playing middle C on both this and your master keyboard (or whatever you use for tuning reference). To do this, you may need to disconnect the analogue synth from the USB SOLO.

2, Connect the converter to your analogue synth and MIDI system. Check the USB SOLO is switched to the correct scaling system, Hz/V for Korg and Yamaha, or V/oct for anything else (see Editing Parameters section). Set transpose to zero. Now press bottom C (MIDI note #36) on your digital synth. Both synths should sound, don’t worry at this stage if they are not in tune.

3, Using bottom C (MIDI note #36) as a reference (you must use this note for maximum accuracy) tune in the USB SOLO with your analogue synth by adjusting the parameter FINE TUNE and TRANSPOSE if necessary (see Editing Parameters section) until it is exactly in tune.

4, When your digital & analogue synths are in tune at the bottom , play middle C, two octaves up on your digital synth. (MIDI note #60). Now adjust the SCALE parameter (see Editing Parameters section) until both synths are in tune. The analogue synth should now play correctly across it’s complete range from your master keyboard, if this is still not the case go back to step 3 and repeat the process for final tweaking.

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goldphinga
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Re: Voyager Midi timing feels a little out compared to LP2

Post by goldphinga » Tue Oct 22, 2013 12:54 pm

Yeah midi timing in the voyager isn't as tight as my lps2 and minitaur. Be nice if there was an update that could improve things in this dept. I wonder if it's possible.
Moog Gear: Voyager AE,LP Stage 2+CV outs (Blue LED's/Wheels, MF104SD, MF101 Filter, MF103 Phaser, Source, Memorymoog+, Minitaur.

GovernorSilver
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Re: Voyager Midi timing feels a little out compared to LP2

Post by GovernorSilver » Wed Oct 23, 2013 2:17 pm

Wonder why there's so few complaints about this issue. Is everybody else just sequencing the Voyager via CV? Or maybe just handful of people out of 1000s with a bum MIDI circuit in their Voyagers.

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goldphinga
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Re: Voyager Midi timing feels a little out compared to LP2

Post by goldphinga » Wed Oct 23, 2013 2:55 pm

Not sure- I always havd to offset all the timing on the midi with voyager as it's always late- the minitaur and lp I have are super tight over USB. I'd like to see an upgrade to the midi side of the voyager to improve timing and maybe they could make a Voyager mk2 with USB! Still- the voyager is an incredible piece of kit. couldn't do without it!
Moog Gear: Voyager AE,LP Stage 2+CV outs (Blue LED's/Wheels, MF104SD, MF101 Filter, MF103 Phaser, Source, Memorymoog+, Minitaur.

francesco
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Re: Voyager Midi timing feels a little out compared to LP2

Post by francesco » Wed Oct 23, 2013 4:36 pm

No problem with Midi timing here (Voyager RME). Voyager is connected via MIDI In/Out 1 of my RME HDSP 9652 PCI card.
Due to the 14-bit resolution of the front-panel controls the amount of transmitted data can become very high! It is very important to avoid Midi loops.
This can be done by setting the Voyager to Local-Off or in my case, because I have a RME, by disabeling the Midi Input from the Voyager in the active DAW track (activate the MIDI input only for the recording of some knob action on the voyager).
Synths: Moog MiniTaur, Taurus III, Voyager RME & VX351& VX352 & CP251 & MP201 DAW: Cubase 8.5 on WIN10 AMD Phenom II X6

GovernorSilver
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Re: Voyager Midi timing feels a little out compared to LP2

Post by GovernorSilver » Thu Oct 24, 2013 10:38 am

My curiosity is piqued. I'll set up an Octatrack MIDI sequence at 300 bpm and send it to my Voyager to see if it can keep up.

I have software OS 3.5 and all the hardware upgrades.

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goldphinga
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Re: Voyager Midi timing feels a little out compared to LP2

Post by goldphinga » Thu Oct 24, 2013 10:50 am

The voyager has a pretty bad in built latency from the point of triggering-
From the innerclock systems website litmus test:

"Trigger In to Audio Out Latency Range = 177 samples (3.69ms) "

And that says a lot. For example the akai mpc 3000 has 1 sample latency!!

No wonder the 3k feels super tight and the voyager feels baggy.
Moog Gear: Voyager AE,LP Stage 2+CV outs (Blue LED's/Wheels, MF104SD, MF101 Filter, MF103 Phaser, Source, Memorymoog+, Minitaur.

GovernorSilver
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Re: Voyager Midi timing feels a little out compared to LP2

Post by GovernorSilver » Thu Oct 24, 2013 2:05 pm

I'll be sure to update the gang after my MIDI sequencing test.

I just saw this girl play a show with a Voyager and she was sequencing it for bass lines - she only touched it to turn some knobs (no manual playing on the keyboard) - never noticed a lag in the Voyager's timing compared to other sequenced stuff:

https://soundcloud.com/computer-magic/another-science

GovernorSilver
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Re: Voyager Midi timing feels a little out compared to LP2

Post by GovernorSilver » Thu Oct 24, 2013 2:21 pm

Hmm, in this video, the MIDI sequenced Voyager stays in time with the drum machine that is providing the MIDI sequence. I don't hear any lag there either.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i4wAoE0-lKU

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goldphinga
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Re: Voyager Midi timing feels a little out compared to LP2

Post by goldphinga » Fri Oct 25, 2013 3:52 pm

We are talking milliseconds but theres a big difference between 1 and 177 samples delay. It's something you sense when firing midi back from your daw, it would be hard to pick up from a video.
Moog Gear: Voyager AE,LP Stage 2+CV outs (Blue LED's/Wheels, MF104SD, MF101 Filter, MF103 Phaser, Source, Memorymoog+, Minitaur.

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MBlom
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Re: Voyager Midi timing feels a little out compared to LP2

Post by MBlom » Fri Oct 25, 2013 5:19 pm

I don't have any numbers or technical knowledge, but I sometimes FEEL like it's a little slow. Especially with fast 16th note sequences with snappy bass sounds.
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