Individual Modules

System 55 • System 35 • Model 15
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latigid on
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Re: Individual Modules

Post by latigid on » Wed Aug 05, 2015 5:09 am

Fair points, although I believe that they could redesign modules for modern manufacture without compromising on sonics. Moog will certainly incorporate a top-notch interface with quality hardware. Personally I'm not after "the" classic Moog sound, but I appreciate that there are many who are. So I wish you luck and good vibes on your sonic journeys. 8)

EricK
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Re: Individual Modules

Post by EricK » Wed Aug 05, 2015 11:23 pm

It's not just the sound, it's the build quality too.
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bichuelo
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Re: Individual Modules

Post by bichuelo » Thu Aug 06, 2015 12:19 am

EricK wrote:It's not just the sound, it's the build quality too.
Which also means it they are easier to service. The through-hole boards are easier to service than the SMD ones.
That's why some of the vintage units are still working...
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Re: Individual Modules

Post by Bryan B » Thu Aug 06, 2015 10:57 am

fyvewytches wrote:
Bryan B wrote: I put my name on a list at Moog as soon as I saw the Emerson modular
List ? What list ? How does one get onto that list ???
I asked if they would sell me just the filter module and they said "No, but if we do that in the future we will put you on the interested list". I don't think it is a promise that it is happening, but more of a gauge of interest to sway them one way or the other when the time comes to decide if that is worth doing.
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Re: Individual Modules

Post by EricK » Thu Feb 18, 2021 2:19 pm

This deserves to be bumped with the hopes that Moog will still consider the option to sell individual modules instead of shuttering the modular line when the Model 10 and Vocoder are retired.

I managed to scrape up the funds for a Model 10 but there are still a couple of modules that were only available to customers if they could afford the 3C/P or the EMMS.

904B/C HPF and Coupler
905 Reverb
911a Dual Trigger Delay
912 Envelope Follower
928 Sanple and Hold
984 Matrix Mixer


I'd still like to have a 921 if not a bank of 921abb with a couple of extra vcas just to comprise a second moog voice. The Model 10 is a tone monster but just being able to swap the 907 for the 907a to free up an extra space for a second VCA would improve upon an otherwise solid configuration.

There are a lot of different suggestions that Moog could pursue:
1. Require the purchase of a cabinet to ensure the module(s) ship with an approved power supply.
2. Set a minumum purchase price point to justify the allocation of company resources.
3. Keep the window of availability to two-three years consistent with some of the previous systems.



These modules represent some of the company's best and most iconic offerings. Please consider allowing some limited availability á la carte options for hardcore Moog enthusiasts before you retire the line.
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AlakaLazlo
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Re: Individual Modules

Post by AlakaLazlo » Sun Mar 21, 2021 2:10 pm

I wouldn't hold my breath... I've been begging for individual modules for (literally) 30 years. Don't think is is ever going to happen.

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Re: Individual Modules

Post by EricK » Sun Mar 21, 2021 4:32 pm

AL,
It doesn't make any damn sense.
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Re: Individual Modules

Post by AlakaLazlo » Sat Apr 03, 2021 2:56 pm

Hello Erik! LTNS Hope you and yours are safe and healthy.

I 100% agree that makes no sense. There would be so many ways to do this that would be very profitable for Moog, but for one reason or another, they just blow it off. Perhaps they are just trying to shore up the price of vintage and reissue systems, but I don't see how selling modules would actually do that. Clearly they can make individual modules as the new reissue systems are identical as far as card connectors and voltage requirements. And I know thay have replacement parts as I just bought 8 of the lighted control voltage routing switches - to replace the 50 year old failing ones from the 2 CP3 mixer panel in my IIP - directly from Moog!

They could take deposits on modules once they have enough OEM parts available, and ship them when completed. Obviously they'd be at a premium as the costs to build the legacy systems are reduced because they can buy parts at scale, but I'd gladly pay a premium to cover that and I suspect many other people (including many of their "Moog Artists" would as well.

I've spoken with guys in the Moog booth at at every show I've attended since the 90s. I've sent dozens of emails, and even set a letter directly to Mike Adams (which was on my lawyer letterhead and with my firm's logo on the envelope, so I assume someone didn't just trash it). I offered to pay 2x in advance for a 904C which is all I've wanted since Lightner restored my IIP. (I'd also take a third 911 just to fill out my #2 P Cabinet.)

In person responses at shows have been, generally "we have no plans to do that, but you never know..." while emails and my letter have not received any response at all. One guy (who shall remain nameless) in the Moog booth at NAMM (in I think 2018?) told me (I kid you not!) that if I wanted one that bad, I should buy a soon to be available IIIP, pull the 904C, and sell the rest.

I bought a 16V Moog One and a Reissue Model D instead...

But the quest continues!

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analogmonster
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Re: Individual Modules

Post by analogmonster » Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:07 am

Hello *,

really, this is ridiculous.

If Moog doesn't want to sell / deliver modules, others can do. What do people collect? Musical instruments or brands? Logos? "Passed" sticker or stamps of Moog? Really, I've seen an ebay auction where a 995 attenuator was offered for a starting price of several hundreds of bucks. Yes, the "Passed" stamp was in perfect condition, but the rest was more a rusty panel sheet with old potentimeters of unknown condition.

What do you want to pay for a 904C? Two times of what price? Have you ever looked at the circuit drawing of a 904C? It might help to look here and count the components. We are still talking about a technical part of an electronic music instrument, don't we? What does a 904C consist of? A 4 tranny double differential amplifier stage and a single transistor output buffer!

Creating a collector's mythology seems to be the equivalent to the license of printing your own money. Moog creates good sounding electronic music instruments, but definitely doesn't sell the Holy Grail, for which replacement parts seem to be less hard to find than buying modules.

It is always better to buy the original brand instead of remakes, but this behaviour of Moog no one has to tolerate. Good grief! Buy a 904C from others, if Moog doesn't want to sell one to you, or build your own.

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Re: Individual Modules

Post by EricK » Mon Apr 05, 2021 4:24 am

AlakaLazlo,
Thanks for the kind wishes! I hope you and your loved ones have been and remain free of the virus as well.

This has been a really frustrating situation for me because Moog's products are so good and all I want to do is support the company and build a custom instrument using things that they already make. Additionally, if what Gene Stopp said in one of the interviews he did is true--that they can make any quantity they want--then it just doesn't make sense to tell customers like us that our money is no good.

Here's the dig. I know someone who made some inquiries to Moog about purchasing some special order parts and ended up accidentally included on an internal email chain. The term "worm-herders" was used as a caveat for satisfying certain customer demands. They ended up fulfilling the order for that customer. Glad you managed to get your switches.

Kanye West got an all-black Voyager from Moog at one time. Bernie Worrell likewise got a purple Voyager (that sold for 1700 bucks at auction after his death). They bend over backwards for some customers.

My requests have been increasingly compromised. If you won't sell me a module just sell me the hardcover manual. Just sell me the ELP art panel from the EMMS. How about the metal logo badge from the 953? How about the new Moog screwdriver?

Who wants to buy a IIIp with a missing 904c? Someone out there could, I suspect, make a killing by parting out a system. The IIIP itself is a flawed and incomplete configuration (3 osc bank but one filter bank). Why sell the system with the blank panel on there and not give the option for something else? If you already are dropping 10 grand, why not exchange the 907 for the 907a and use the extra space for an extra VCA? Swap out that 901 for a 921. It's difficult to believe it's an issue about profitability and/or manpower allocation.

I really don't want to make these kinds of criticisms public.

Analogmonster,

Below is a picture of my system. Moslab/Synth-Werk are virtually identical to the Moog sound. Nobody can convince me that there is anything but the most negligible difference (I'm in the process of demonstrating this through a series of videos). I compiled this custom clone since 2015, having ordered the initial few modules before they announced the run of modulars. The entire time they told us individual modules weren't planned. So with the exception of the Bode Frequency Shifter and the Sample and Hold module, and the reverb I have the configuration that I believe is the perfect Moog configuration. I don't believe for a second that Moslab or Synth-Werk or any other module company would fetch the prices that Moog would in the unfortunate event that I would have to part with any of it it. Maybe if they saturate the market through a la carte modules they can't justify what they ask for the bigger systems. The desire for Moog in light of the fact that the clones have the tone is purely irrational. I just want to buy something that they already are currently manufacturing.
I believe these modules are some of the best products that they have ever produced and it's upsetting that they are being extraordinarily selective about who can get them. Moog has proven over the years that they can and will sell whatever they want and whatever price point. If they anticipate their modular line to be only a three year run, then why not herd all the worms they can that bring their wallets with them?

When they released the X5 modulars in 2015, Roger Arrick remarked that he got tons or orders. Moslab got my money that could have been Moogs. It's just a disappointment.

I love Moog and I don't always agree with the direction that they are going, but they are currently making things that I want to buy and It will be unfortunate if they quietly cease production of modules and turn us away empty-handed.

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AlakaLazlo
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Re: Individual Modules

Post by AlakaLazlo » Mon Apr 05, 2021 11:48 am

analogmonster wrote: Sun Apr 04, 2021 7:07 am What do you want to pay for a 904C? Two times of what price? Have you ever looked at the circuit drawing of a 904C?
Sure I could build a 904C, or buy a clone, but that isn't my point. Here's the thing. I want one for deeply personal reasons.

I got my IIP in the 70s. I was a kid and bought it with my dad cosigning my first bank loan. Without going into detail here, it has a significant pedigree and even more significant collectors value. I could sell the IIp and probably buy several reissue systems. But unlike collectors who just want to say "I own X" - I actually still use it as a musical instrument that gives me inspiration to create. I've owned it for more than 40 years, and (if you'll excuse the reference) you'll have to pry it from my cold dead hands. What I want to do is add the one module it was missing when I got it. I don't want a fake, I want the real thing. If someone had a vintage 904c for sale, I'd pay a premium for it. If Moog would sell me a real one, I'd gladly pay a premium for that too. But I'm not putting a "fake" module in my system.

I own a wall of other 5U stuff, all of it useful. I could buy a 904 set from several manufacturers , but what I want is a real 904C.

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analogmonster
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Re: Individual Modules

Post by analogmonster » Tue Apr 06, 2021 3:49 am

I understand that. I was fascinated by Moog modulars since I was a child. The music of my heroes, the technical fascination of the "wall of knobs" I saw on LP covers and CD booklets made me swear that some day I will be owner of modular systems. But as I always wanted to look behind the curtain, or better o say to look under the skirt of the technology behind I went the way of analyzing the circuits and building my "system of infinity" on my own. The childhood memory is a strong motivation for a lot of things what we do, and can be very expensive...

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ummagumma
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Re: Individual Modules

Post by ummagumma » Sun Apr 18, 2021 3:38 pm

well the solution seems obvious: send an email as "Kanye West" and maybe you will get your custom module?

:D

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Re: Individual Modules

Post by EricK » Sun Apr 18, 2021 8:11 pm

ummagumma wrote: Sun Apr 18, 2021 3:38 pm well the solution seems obvious: send an email as "Kanye West" and maybe you will get your custom module?

:D
Now you're hitting below the belt. :D
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ummagumma
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Re: Individual Modules

Post by ummagumma » Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:23 pm

or

"Bernie Worrell talks to me through a Ouija board..."

I'm probably going to hell now, just for thinking that. No disrespect intended

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