Religion and Politics thread coming soon....

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MC
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Re: Religion and Politics thread coming soon....

Post by MC » Wed Mar 30, 2016 11:28 am

unfiltered37 wrote:but once you try to control the freedoms and rights of others because of it, you getting into highly negative and hateful areas. Just live and let live.
Oh, so they resent others controlling their freedom and rights, but they cheer when freedom of religion was squashed when christian-based organizations (but curiously not other denominations such as islamic...?) are punished because they refused to compromise their moral standards by refusing to host an LGBT wedding. Got it.

It is a known fact that when gay marriage was in the process of being legalized in NY, LGBT groups vehemently protested when the law was amended to exclude religious houses of worship from prosecution.

You accuse us of getting into highly negative and hateful areas while selective targeting of Christian organizations and political pressure to prevent immunity with religious houses of worship smack of unreputable hallmarks of persecution. And you close your argument with "just live and let live"? Hypocrite much? Rom 1 was so prophetic.

I'm leaving this discussion, this has zilch to do with synthesizers.
Gear list: '04 Saturn Ion, John Deere X300 tractor, ganged set of seven reel mowers for 3 acres of lawn, herd of sheep for backup lawn mowers, two tiger cats for mouse population control Oh you meant MUSIC gear Oops I hit the 255 character limi

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MRNUTTY
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Re: Religion and Politics thread coming soon....

Post by MRNUTTY » Wed Mar 30, 2016 11:41 am

MacAquinas wrote:Ok.The Third Reich was government.
I call Godwins rule! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law Please close the horrible thread.
VoyagerEB, Minitaur, LittlePhattyII, 4xSlimPhatty, Sub37, MF[2x101,2x102,103,104M,105,105B,105M,2x107,108M], 3xCP251, XV351, MP201;
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Re: Religion and Politics thread coming soon....

Post by thealien666 » Wed Mar 30, 2016 11:44 am

unfiltered37 wrote:Oh spare me that holier than thou crap. If you want to believe in primitive mythology written by men who didn't know where the sun went at night, fine, but don't try to impose your beliefs on others....
We've had our differences in the past, but I must admit that you are absolutely right about this, and I agree 100% with you. Live and let live. If one's religion or beliefs makes him or her do harmless but completely ridiculous things, that's okay I guess. But trying to convince others that they should do the same, and worse of all not accepting that others might not agree to follow those rules, to the point of wanting to destroy the non-believers in some extreme cases, is dead wrong.

We're on this planet a very very short time, on the time scale of the universe, and we're pretentious enough to believe that we're currently the most intelligent thing living on earth, so why is it that we're so dumb as to not enjoy our short stay in this world in peace ?
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MacAquinas
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Re: Religion and Politics thread coming soon....

Post by MacAquinas » Wed Mar 30, 2016 12:00 pm

MRNUTTY wrote:
MacAquinas wrote:Ok.The Third Reich was government.
I call Godwins rule! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law Please close the horrible thread.

I call MacAquinas' Rule "when someone sees a fair fight and their buddies are getting counter-punched and not allowed to bully their way over opposition. They invoke Godwin's Rule"

See This Thread, no link required. You are part of it now, not hovering above it.
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TimeEchoProductions
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Re: Religion and Politics thread coming soon....

Post by TimeEchoProductions » Wed Mar 30, 2016 12:45 pm

thealien666 wrote:
unfiltered37 wrote:Oh spare me that holier than thou crap. If you want to believe in primitive mythology written by men who didn't know where the sun went at night, fine, but don't try to impose your beliefs on others....
We've had our differences in the past, but I must admit that you are absolutely right about this, and I agree 100% with you. Live and let live. If one's religion or beliefs makes him or her do harmless but completely ridiculous things, that's okay I guess. But trying to convince others that they should do the same, and worse of all not accepting that others might not agree to follow those rules, to the point of wanting to destroy the non-believers in some extreme cases, is dead wrong.

We're on this planet a very very short time, on the time scale of the universe, and we're pretentious enough to believe that we're currently the most intelligent thing living on earth, so why is it that we're so dumb as to not enjoy our short stay in this world in peace ?

Thumbs up!
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MRNUTTY
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Re: Religion and Politics thread coming soon....

Post by MRNUTTY » Wed Mar 30, 2016 12:56 pm

MacAquinas wrote:
MRNUTTY wrote:
MacAquinas wrote:Ok.The Third Reich was government.
I call Godwins rule! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law Please close the horrible thread.

I call MacAquinas' Rule "when someone sees a fair fight and their buddies are getting counter-punched and not allowed to bully their way over opposition. They invoke Godwin's Rule"

See This Thread, no link required. You are part of it now, not hovering above it.
At this point, all I can do is laugh. Not at you, just in general. It's so much more healthy for you! :-)
VoyagerEB, Minitaur, LittlePhattyII, 4xSlimPhatty, Sub37, MF[2x101,2x102,103,104M,105,105B,105M,2x107,108M], 3xCP251, XV351, MP201;
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wordsdrawnigh
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Re: Religion and Politics thread coming soon....

Post by wordsdrawnigh » Wed Mar 30, 2016 2:24 pm

thealien666 wrote: We've had our differences in the past, but I must admit that you are absolutely right about this, and I agree 100% with you. Live and let live. If one's religion or beliefs makes him or her do harmless but completely ridiculous things, that's okay I guess. But trying to convince others that they should do the same, and worse of all not accepting that others might not agree to follow those rules, to the point of wanting to destroy the non-believers in some extreme cases, is dead wrong.
I totally agree. If one's beliefs leads him or her (or zie or hir or whatever other pronoun they insist others use) to mutilate their bodies and embrace an autogynephiliac lifestyle, they are free to do this. But trying to convince others they should do the same (http://4thwavenow.com/2016/01/18/teen-d ... -pressure/), and worse of all not accepting that others might not agree to follow those rules, to the point of wanting to destroy the non-believers in some extreme cases (https://transcriticalhate.wordpress.com), is dead wrong.

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Re: Religion and Politics thread coming soon....

Post by MacAquinas » Wed Mar 30, 2016 5:11 pm

MRNUTTY wrote:
At this point, all I can do is laugh. Not at you, just in general. It's so much more healthy for you! :-)
"I've gone back to being a child': Husband and father-of-seven, 52, leaves his wife and kids to live as a transgender SIX-YEAR-OLD girl named Stefonknee"

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/artic ... nknee.html

Send Stefonknee a Little Phatty for some trans 6 year old Synthesize Love.
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Re: Religion and Politics thread coming soon....

Post by MRNUTTY » Wed Mar 30, 2016 6:07 pm

MacAquinas wrote:
MRNUTTY wrote:
At this point, all I can do is laugh. Not at you, just in general. It's so much more healthy for you! :-)
"I've gone back to being a child': Husband and father-of-seven, 52, leaves his wife and kids to live as a transgender SIX-YEAR-OLD girl named Stefonknee"

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/artic ... nknee.html

Send Stefonknee a Little Phatty for some trans 6 year old Synthesize Love.
Yes, and of course ALL transgender people are EXACTLY like this, and you will NEVER find and example even REMOTELY like this associated with someone that is NOT transgender. Come on, MacAquinas if you're going to make a point, make it sensibly and sensibly. Do you even know someone that is transgender? Are familiar with mental anguish these people go through? Do you have some examples of sympathy you would like to share? These are real people just trying to get along in a world that they don't fit in. I am not attacking you. I would celebrate a rational conclusion to this thread. But there won't be one. And that's sad, because as someone mentioned without Wendy Carlos, and a lot of what Moog did, or might have done would not be possible. That the company made a stand is laudable, and I'm glad they did. Why you are upset is beyond me.

Anyway, check out my studio in the "Tell us about your rig" thread. It's fun and unbiased in every way! You'll like it!
VoyagerEB, Minitaur, LittlePhattyII, 4xSlimPhatty, Sub37, MF[2x101,2x102,103,104M,105,105B,105M,2x107,108M], 3xCP251, XV351, MP201;
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Re: Religion and Politics thread coming soon....

Post by MRNUTTY » Wed Mar 30, 2016 6:20 pm

OK, now I see it. Your intent was to start a thread to incite discussion, then cherry pick responses to attack on the basis of some incongruity the poster may have revealed. Well, jolly good one MacAquinas! Touche! :?
VoyagerEB, Minitaur, LittlePhattyII, 4xSlimPhatty, Sub37, MF[2x101,2x102,103,104M,105,105B,105M,2x107,108M], 3xCP251, XV351, MP201;
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Re: Religion and Politics thread coming soon....

Post by MacAquinas » Wed Mar 30, 2016 6:52 pm

MRNUTTY wrote:
MacAquinas wrote:
MRNUTTY wrote:
At this point, all I can do is laugh. Not at you, just in general. It's so much more healthy for you! :-)


Anyway, check out my studio in the "Tell us about your rig" thread. It's fun and unbiased in every way! You'll like it!

I saw a few posts of your studio and it is magnificent, you have a living dream.

My point in starting the thread was as I said in the original post, that it was certain to bring out the worst in us all at some point and that we on this forum as well as Moog in their customer correspondence should only be about music and musical instruments like your beautiful studio. That uncontroversial focus will unite us and keep us all civil. I will not post again to this thread or read it and if i could delete it I would.

Thanks Mr. Nutty.
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Re: Religion and Politics thread coming soon....

Post by MRNUTTY » Wed Mar 30, 2016 7:09 pm

MacAquinas, First of all; thank you for your compliments. It's one of a number of projects to keep me busy in my retirement. Second of all, I think if you had merely said what you just said, everyone would have agreed. Those not in agreement may have made themselves a nuisance, but we would have had started from a point of common consensus. Third, you made several comments in other threads prior to this one that appeared to show a pattern of dissatisfaction with the letter, or it's contents, or the actions of the company. I admit I throughly missed your point above and labeled you a miscontent bent on a mission to disrupt the board. As a result, I will tell you I made a series of reports about your posts being off-topic and apologize - in advance - if action is taken against you. Lastly, I expect my experience was similar to others and submit to you that you made a tactical error in how you approached the topic of being off-topic by using a clearly emotionally charged subject that the majority of us misconstrued your intent.

I enjoy the board as a place for sharing music, gear, and musicians alike, just as you do. Given something other than transgender politics, it might have all gone a different way. I hope that these last two posts can get the thread on track and even our collective keel once more. In the meantime, I'll endevour to repair the damage I may have done. :-) Thanks and good luck!

John
VoyagerEB, Minitaur, LittlePhattyII, 4xSlimPhatty, Sub37, MF[2x101,2x102,103,104M,105,105B,105M,2x107,108M], 3xCP251, XV351, MP201;
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wordsdrawnigh
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Re: Religion and Politics thread coming soon....

Post by wordsdrawnigh » Wed Mar 30, 2016 8:07 pm

MRNUTTY wrote: Yes, and of course ALL transgender people are EXACTLY like this, and you will NEVER find and example even REMOTELY like this associated with someone that is NOT transgender. Come on, MacAquinas if you're going to make a point, make it sensibly and sensibly. Do you even know someone that is transgender? Are familiar with mental anguish these people go through? Do you have some examples of sympathy you would like to share? These are real people just trying to get along in a world that they don't fit in. I am not attacking you. I would celebrate a rational conclusion to this thread. But there won't be one. And that's sad, because as someone mentioned without Wendy Carlos, and a lot of what Moog did, or might have done would not be possible. That the company made a stand is laudable, and I'm glad they did. Why you are upset is beyond me.
So MRNUTTY, have you ever heard of otherkin? If I told you that I was a lycanthrope born in the body of a human, would you accept my "species dysphoria" as legitimate? Would you begin to believe in the existence of werewolves? Or what if I told you that, as a white person, I am a "trans-African" (because, after all, I have always loved jazz and hip-hop, and feel black on the inside)?

Whatever the musical accomplishments of Wendy Carlos, they have no bearing on the legitimacy of transgenderism. I am trans-critical because I am sympathetic to transpeople. I want these people to get psychotherapy before they do something they will come to regret. Children are now being taught about "gender identity" in kindergarten. You think it is reasonable to give puberty-blocking drugs to children who do not fully understand the implications of this decision, because they decided on a whim that they are "actually a boy/girl"?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/artic ... z2AjFa43a9
http://thefederalist.com/2015/08/19/tra ... otherwise/

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Re: Religion and Politics thread coming soon....

Post by MRNUTTY » Wed Mar 30, 2016 8:23 pm

Wordsdrawnigh, thank you for expressing your insights. However, as I discovered, the point of the thread was to keep all this discussion off the board. And I agree with it. So, whatever I believe with regard to the worthy points you bring up, I won't be expressing them on this board anymore. But, I will talk about my studio in the "tell us about your rig" thread :-) see you there!
VoyagerEB, Minitaur, LittlePhattyII, 4xSlimPhatty, Sub37, MF[2x101,2x102,103,104M,105,105B,105M,2x107,108M], 3xCP251, XV351, MP201;
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unfiltered37
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Re: Religion and Politics thread coming soon....

Post by unfiltered37 » Wed Mar 30, 2016 8:42 pm

MC wrote:
unfiltered37 wrote:but once you try to control the freedoms and rights of others because of it, you getting into highly negative and hateful areas. Just live and let live.
Oh, so they resent others controlling their freedom and rights, but they cheer when freedom of religion was squashed when christian-based organizations (but curiously not other denominations such as islamic...?) are punished because they refused to compromise their moral standards by refusing to host an LGBT wedding. Got it.

It is a known fact that when gay marriage was in the process of being legalized in NY, LGBT groups vehemently protested when the law was amended to exclude religious houses of worship from prosecution.

You accuse us of getting into highly negative and hateful areas while selective targeting of Christian organizations and political pressure to prevent immunity with religious houses of worship smack of unreputable hallmarks of persecution. And you close your argument with "just live and let live"? Hypocrite much? Rom 1 was so prophetic.

I'm leaving this discussion, this has zilch to do with synthesizers.


That's like saying you shouldn't be forced to serve black people if they enter your restaurant. After all, that's govt imposing their views on others. there's a difference between laws and rights that are inclusive of rights vs those that are exclusive. The companies that refuse to serve gays are not exercising their rights. They don't have to be in business, they don't have to serve black people. By establishing a business, they forgo their rights to be discriminatory. They cannot discriminate based on race, gender, religion, or sexual orientation (although you can still be fired just for being gay in most states). This whole "religious freedom' movement is nothing but bigotry in disguise. You have every right to practice your voodoo and I will fight for your right to do it, but this is a secular society, and you have to respect the rights of others in order to live in a civil society.

Before civil rights, churches used the bible and claims of religious freedom to discriminate against blacks. In fact i am sure there are churches today that believe it's their religious right to hate blacks and feel their religious freedom is impinged upon. The moment we say that because of religious beliefs, any sort of discrimination or religious exemption is allowed, we go back to Jim Crow and segregation. And, a fact that christians don't like to talk about, sharia law and satanism and all the religions you don't like will have the same "religious freedoms' you advocate so much. You might as well fight for the islamic right to subjugate women and the religious freedom for satanists to have animal sacrifices. But you don't think about those things do you? You just think about your own christian "religious freedom" because self-interest is all that matters, right?

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