RE: Mini / Multi - Home Recording (FX)?

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MRNUTTY
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Re: RE: Mini / Multi - Home Recording (FX)?

Post by MRNUTTY » Fri Jun 26, 2015 3:21 pm

monsterjazzlicks wrote: I never heard of 'anharmonic' though before? Just enharmonic and disharmomic.

Wat is IRL please? You mean that you were working in IRELAND?
Anharmonic is good - "Anharmonic oscillation is defined as the deviation of a system from harmonic oscillation, or an oscillator not oscillating in simple harmonic motion."

In any event, what I'm trying to say is = "not having an even or odd harmonic relationship with the rest of the source material, such as what you would hear from a balanced modulator"

IRL - is In Real Life, of course! In this case, my 36 year career before retiring was mostly spent in large computer systems digital hardware design. Digital is just special case of analog design. ;-)

Updated - reading this again, I think the first part, which I bolded above, expresses it best; where the system of harmonic oscillation is that which is represented in the original harmonic content of the input signal. The Anharmonic content then is that which is not harmonically related to the input, thus anharmonic. The Balanced, or Ring, Modulator from the early PAIA kits I built in the late 70's introduced me to this term. The sound FLOORED me back then, it was INSANE! I feel sort of jaded now, not much gives me that novel BANG anymore. Although, a lot of it really is still cool :-)
VoyagerEB, Minitaur, LittlePhattyII, 4xSlimPhatty, Sub37, MF[2x101,2x102,103,104M,105,105B,105M,2x107,108M], 3xCP251, XV351, MP201;
2xMother 32, DFAM, Subharmonicon;
System 55 and Minimoog clones with lots of mods.

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Re: RE: Mini / Multi - Home Recording (FX)?

Post by monsterjazzlicks » Fri Jun 26, 2015 7:24 pm

MrNutty,

Thanks very much indeed for the reply and update!

Been busy tryin' to get a damn SAX sound out of the MULTI! lol

Cheers,

Paul

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thealien666
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Re: RE: Mini / Multi - Home Recording (FX)?

Post by thealien666 » Fri Jun 26, 2015 7:47 pm

monsterjazzlicks wrote:Been busy tryin' to get a damn SAX sound out of the MULTI! lol
Get a Korg M1, someone told me that it has a pretty good one... :twisted:
Moog Minimoog D (1975)
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Re: RE: Mini / Multi - Home Recording (FX)?

Post by monsterjazzlicks » Fri Jun 26, 2015 8:13 pm

Alien,
thealien666 wrote:
monsterjazzlicks wrote:Been busy tryin' to get a damn SAX sound out of the MULTI! lol
Get a Korg M1, someone told me that it has a pretty good one... :twisted:
Ha ha . . . Advanced Integrated Synthesis (whatever that is :?)!

Paul

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MRNUTTY
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Re: RE: Mini / Multi - Home Recording (FX)?

Post by MRNUTTY » Fri Jun 26, 2015 8:18 pm

thealien666 wrote:
monsterjazzlicks wrote:Been busy tryin' to get a damn SAX sound out of the MULTI! lol
Get a Korg M1, someone told me that it has a pretty good one... :twisted:
You can even get the iM1 iOS app with all the ROM cards for less than the cost of an M1 off ebay. Which is great! except I have an M1 I don't want anymore :-( Seriously though, the app sounds awesome! quite a few great sax sounds there besides the basic ROM.
VoyagerEB, Minitaur, LittlePhattyII, 4xSlimPhatty, Sub37, MF[2x101,2x102,103,104M,105,105B,105M,2x107,108M], 3xCP251, XV351, MP201;
2xMother 32, DFAM, Subharmonicon;
System 55 and Minimoog clones with lots of mods.

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Re: RE: Mini / Multi - Home Recording (FX)?

Post by monsterjazzlicks » Fri Jun 26, 2015 8:36 pm

Hi MrNutty,
MRNUTTY wrote:You can even get the iM1 iOS app with all the ROM cards for less than the cost of an M1 off ebay. Which is great! except I have an M1 I don't want anymore :-( Seriously though, the app sounds awesome! quite a few great sax sounds there besides the basic ROM.
I think everyone in the world heard the KORG M1 sounds!lol They were everywhere (esp.the PIANO and ORGAN).

I can't get a convincing SAX out of the MULTI at all. I was trying to get a SOLO TENOR. But I think I might be able to fake it if I LAYER, so that it sounds like 2 x SAXES. So it's back to the drawing board . . .

There is always a way around things but it just might not be exactly what you wanted in the first placed. Though anything is better than nothing!

Ta,

Paul

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thealien666
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Re: RE: Mini / Multi - Home Recording (FX)?

Post by thealien666 » Fri Jun 26, 2015 9:08 pm

You can probably get a decent enough flute or clarinet with a slightly filtered square waveform, and an "acceptable" oboe facsimile with a slightly filtered pulse waveform. But a saxophone is not an easy waveform to imitate with the simplistic and basic waveforms available on a classic analog synths.
Moog Minimoog D (1975)
DSI OB6
DSI Prophet REV2
Oberheim Matrix-6
Ensoniq SQ-80
Korg DW8000
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Re: RE: Mini / Multi - Home Recording (FX)?

Post by monsterjazzlicks » Fri Jun 26, 2015 9:25 pm

Sure Alien,

I am going to try and LAYER and use a SAW (wave). Adding a slight amount of OCTAVE DOUBLE (at 1 x octave below) helps get it close-ish (by MOOG standards) to a TENOR. And a bit of DETUNING to fake 2 x players might work. I guess it is one of them where WHAT and HOW you use it (for) hopefully TRANSCENDS what it actually IS! That's how all the old school players of yesteryear must have approached it (and got such excellent results [buggers!]).

Will give it a bash over the weekend.

And oh yes, beautiful CLARINETS are obtainable!

Paul
Last edited by monsterjazzlicks on Sat Jun 27, 2015 12:01 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Piktor
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Re: RE: Mini / Multi - Home Recording (FX)?

Post by Piktor » Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:53 pm

Hi Paul,

Been loosely following this thread and I just thought that I would interject for moment to offer a little information. I'm not sure if you are literally trying to get the sound of a saxophone on the Multimoog, or if you are trying to get an expressive sound that is saxophone-like. I am far from an expert, but don't think that the Multi is going to get you a saxophone sound. I don't really think that you have to have that exact sound to have some of the effect. Even though people claim that Steve Winwood's "When You See A Chance" Multimoog lines sound like a sax, I don't hear that. I DO hear an expressive sound shaped by a voltage control pedal manipulating the Multi's filter. Maybe that's what you are going for?

On the other hand, you might find this enlightening. Flavio Premoli from the band PFM did use a Micromoog (basically a Multi minus the second oscillator and after touch) on some recordings. I don't know if that is what he used here, but after 4:35 you can hear a pretty good sax imitation (IMO) for a recording that was made in 1977.

Cheers

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Re: RE: Mini / Multi - Home Recording (FX)?

Post by Piktor » Fri Jun 26, 2015 10:54 pm


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MRNUTTY
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Re: RE: Mini / Multi - Home Recording (FX)?

Post by MRNUTTY » Sat Jun 27, 2015 8:03 am

Good call piktor, sounds like a saprano sax :-)
VoyagerEB, Minitaur, LittlePhattyII, 4xSlimPhatty, Sub37, MF[2x101,2x102,103,104M,105,105B,105M,2x107,108M], 3xCP251, XV351, MP201;
2xMother 32, DFAM, Subharmonicon;
System 55 and Minimoog clones with lots of mods.

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Re: RE: Mini / Multi - Home Recording (FX)?

Post by monsterjazzlicks » Sat Jun 27, 2015 12:21 pm

Thank you for your helpful input Piktor,
Piktor wrote:I'm not sure if you are literally trying to get the sound of a saxophone on the Multimoog, or if you are trying to get an expressive sound that is saxophone-like. I am far from an expert, but don't think that the Multi is going to get you a saxophone sound. I don't really think that you have to have that exact sound to have some of the effect. Even though people claim that Steve Winwood's "When You See A Chance" Multimoog lines sound like a sax, I don't hear that. I DO hear an expressive sound shaped by a voltage control pedal manipulating the Multi's filter. Maybe that's what you are going for?
Gee, I never heard that song before so I am really pleased you referred me to it! What a GREAT keyboard player (whoever he is?) on Hammond, Piano, Multi and Synth Strings! He did a superb job on that track (which sounds very much like GENESIS in places).

Yes, the MULTI really does sound extremely expressive here as you say. I have never tried/considered using a PEDAL with the MULTI (as you suspect this guy may be doing). I would say that it is a close to a SAX as you might obtain from a MULTI, and also the way the performer PLAYED it makes it sound more realistic (than the patch would sound if you just played a basic C Major Scale on it with no articulations). He did everything in the right place.

I wish my MUTLI sounded as good as his(!):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNidUTQiutw

Cheers,

Paul

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Re: RE: Mini / Multi - Home Recording (FX)?

Post by monsterjazzlicks » Sat Jun 27, 2015 12:36 pm

Piktor,
Piktor wrote:On the other hand, you might find this enlightening. Flavio Premoli from the band PFM did use a Micromoog (basically a Multi minus the second oscillator and after touch) on some recordings. I don't know if that is what he used here, but after 4:35 you can hear a pretty good sax imitation (IMO) for a recording that was made in 1977.
I had not heard of this band before?

The song has a very long fade-in! lol Nice artwork on front cover also. Sounds quite a metric piece in that it changes from 9/8 to 5/8 (so must have been very tricky to sing over for sure!). I would call it (if pushed for a description): Progressive Rock with some Folk thrown in.

If it was intended to be a SAX then I think it is a little more convincing after the @ 5:00 mark onwards. However, personally, I felt the WINWOOD recording/playing is superior (although I thoroughly did enjoy this PFM experience, thank you).

Ta,

Paul
Last edited by monsterjazzlicks on Sat Jun 27, 2015 7:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: RE: Mini / Multi - Home Recording (FX)?

Post by DonutDude » Sat Jun 27, 2015 1:18 pm

monsterjazzlicks wrote:Sounds quite a metric piece in that it changes from 9/8 to 5/8
Sounds more like 7/4 to 4/4 back and forth, or 11/8 (depending on how you want to write it down). :)

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MRNUTTY
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Re: RE: Mini / Multi - Home Recording (FX)?

Post by MRNUTTY » Sat Jun 27, 2015 4:52 pm

Just a thought - maybe the sax dynamics come from a breath controller. You can get quite wild modifications of plain ADSR envelopes when you mix a breath controller in. Piktor, any production notes with that tune?
VoyagerEB, Minitaur, LittlePhattyII, 4xSlimPhatty, Sub37, MF[2x101,2x102,103,104M,105,105B,105M,2x107,108M], 3xCP251, XV351, MP201;
2xMother 32, DFAM, Subharmonicon;
System 55 and Minimoog clones with lots of mods.

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