S-trigger function on a Percussion Controller/Minimoog D

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Electrong
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S-trigger function on a Percussion Controller/Minimoog D

Post by Electrong » Wed Dec 19, 2012 12:45 pm

I have had a Minimoog D for several years and found a Percussion controller for use with it but I had to wire up a wiring assembly by myself, utilizing the controllers service manual. Still not sure whether it is working as it should. I believe it is, but the question I have is regarding the S-Trigger plug. If my 1130 is working properly, would plugging the S-Trig plug into my Minimoog trigger an "always on" situation with the Minimoog? That is what is happening, and when I play the Percussion controller and plug in one or more of the 1/4" plugs into Loudness, Filter, or Oscillator jacks, the note that is always on is modulated by the amount of signal the Percussion controller sends into it. The filter freq or osc freq or loudness amount then remains constant (accounting for the settings of the 2 pots, sensitivity and scale) until another strike of the drum changes it again.

Does the above description sound correct? Please, if you have a setup with the 1130 Percussion controller and a Minimoog, could you respond? Or, if you already know how they're supposed to work please feel free to chime in? Thank you in advance... It has been a while since I've even posted on the Moog Music Forum but I'm probably going to get back into this..
Minimoog Model D, Roland SH-1, Simmons SDS-8, Rhodes 73 suitcase, Ludwig/Gretsch Drums, Zildjian/Paiste/UFIP cymbals, Various acoustic percussive effects

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MC
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Re: S-trigger function on a Percussion Controller/Minimoog D

Post by MC » Wed Dec 19, 2012 12:59 pm

The S-trig on your 1130 is malfunctioning. It should only trigger the minimoog when the controller is struck.
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CZ Rider
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Re: S-trigger function on a Percussion Controller/Minimoog D

Post by CZ Rider » Wed Dec 19, 2012 2:17 pm

Sounds like the CV's are working correctly, there is a hold circuit on those CV's. So the strike amplitude is converted to a proportional CV and then held. The constant on with the S-trig could be the two blades are wired in reverse, so you could be sending a ground to the trigger blade. One blade is ground the other is the S-trigger, easy to mix up. I would double check the wiring/polarity on that first. Trigger should be a short pulse, can check the V-trig output to verify the trigger portion is working properly too.
Here is a small interface I made to work on a modular setup. You can see all the available outputs, 2 CV's an S-trig and V-trig.
Image
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Electrong
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Re: S-trigger function on a Percussion Controller/Minimoog D

Post by Electrong » Wed Dec 19, 2012 2:38 pm

Thanks! I will try reversing the wiring on the s-trig first. This was a concern because, although the PC could be used to alter notes, they were in a "permanently-on" position, so I was not getting an envelope. On the 2 different 1/4" voltage sends, they are different voltage amounts.. I wish there were an owner's manual for this.. I have only been able to find the service manual
Minimoog Model D, Roland SH-1, Simmons SDS-8, Rhodes 73 suitcase, Ludwig/Gretsch Drums, Zildjian/Paiste/UFIP cymbals, Various acoustic percussive effects

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CZ Rider
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Re: S-trigger function on a Percussion Controller/Minimoog D

Post by CZ Rider » Wed Dec 19, 2012 4:57 pm

Here is the owners manual in zipped form.
Moog Accessories Owners Manual 7MEG ZIP
On the 1130 the CV 1 (RED) and CV 2(BLACK) are the same. The red CV1 is attenuated via the Range knob on the 1130, the CV 2 black is the same but non-attenuated. That setup allows you to plug the red into the Mini oscillator in and black into the filter. With the range knob at zero, the Mini will play the last key pressed, while the 1130 triggers that note while changing the filter, for a rythmic and in tune sample/hold type sound. Turn the range knob up and the Mini will begin to change notes via the 1130. The notes are somewhat random and not exactly in tune, so it might play a "C", or it might be a slightly sharp "C" or in between notes. A quantizer on the pitch input will make those tones more playable and in tune.
Here is a small example, where the first 15 seconds are non-quantized, and the rest of the demo is through a scale quantizer. Making it possible to play a tune on the 1130.
Small MP# demo of 1130 without then with a pitch quantizer
That should give you an idea of how the 1130 should function with a Mini. For those Disco type sounds of the later made drum synths, you would want to get the filter self-oscillating, turn off the oscillators, and use the filter envelope to change the pitch that way. If you had access to a few extra modules you could patch in an extra envelope generator. But the 1130 is really just and envelope follower with a hold at the peak voltage, so no envelope decay comming from the 1130.
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Electrong
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Re: S-trigger function on a Percussion Controller/Minimoog D

Post by Electrong » Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:12 pm

Could you tell me what kind of and the amount of voltage you're getting through the s-trigger (and which blade) when you strike the 1130? I think I may have wired the wiring harness wrong. All the other connections work except the s-trigger. It is producing between 1.7 volts dc without being hit and 2.2v dc after a hit. That doesn't seem right.
Minimoog Model D, Roland SH-1, Simmons SDS-8, Rhodes 73 suitcase, Ludwig/Gretsch Drums, Zildjian/Paiste/UFIP cymbals, Various acoustic percussive effects

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CZ Rider
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Re: S-trigger function on a Percussion Controller/Minimoog D

Post by CZ Rider » Wed Dec 19, 2012 9:49 pm

I'm getting 9.88 volts when not hit from the 1130, and 3.62 volts at the Mini S-trig with nothing plugged in. Should give a 0 volt for only a split second when struck. An S-trig would have an on/off state where off = positive supply potential, and on = 0 volts or ground. The opposite of a V-trig where the off state = 0 volt, and on = positive voltage.
On a standard Cinch two prong Moog S-trigger the larger blade is pin 1 and goes to ground, pin 2 is the narrower one and carries the S-trigger. I usually just use a set of small jumpers to be sure I have the correct wiring on those. No matter what number you call them the narrow one has the trigger, large blade is ground. FWIW I have an old Moog here and from the factory there are two male S-trigger outs wired backward. So even Moog did not always get it right. The only reason I mentioned the S-trigger wiring is if you put ground to pin 2 (narrow one), the Mini will sustain as you described. Could be it is wired correct and the 1130 is defective.
1P Modular,Minimoog,VoyagerRME,CustomMinimoog,Prodigy,MG-1 TaurusII,Opus3,Rogue,Source,Liberation,Micromoog,1125S&H,
1130Perc.x2,1150Ribbonx2,Custom1150,1120Pedal,Songprod,CP-251,VX-351
VX-352,Etherwave,Synampx2,Lil'Phatty,Sonic Six

Electrong
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Re: S-trigger function on a Percussion Controller/Minimoog D

Post by Electrong » Thu Dec 20, 2012 12:07 am

OK I'll check this out more and get back thanks a bunch!
Minimoog Model D, Roland SH-1, Simmons SDS-8, Rhodes 73 suitcase, Ludwig/Gretsch Drums, Zildjian/Paiste/UFIP cymbals, Various acoustic percussive effects

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