Rogue Heresy mods

human fly · Post by **human fly** » Wed Jan 11, 2012 3:54 pm

some mods i've considered for my Rogue, which may be considered
heretical/heresies..i would like to get some comments, instructions,
advice, schems, etc.! i like the dirty character and would like to give
this synth more options. it seems like it could be modded very well into
a more sophisticated unit.

-to remove the keyboard, semi-permanently, allowing me to patch it in
when i want. eg; to turn it into a rackmount cv+gate module, and 'expander',
for other cv+gate gear, and slave it to sequencer, and keep keyboard as a cv+gate
k/b>
-to convert it from s-trig to standard gate trig (eg: compatible with roland triggers)
(switchable)
-any known and tested mods offering x-mod, separation of oscillator wave selection,
and anything else you can think of. ideally, i'd like to incorporate another osc, and be
able to patch in other EGs and LFOs, etc. (inc. 3rd osc for minimoog)

i don't actually see all this as 'heresy' at all. the Rogue is just a base unit to build on.
What do you think?(got great results sequencing it with a mc202 with the jacks halfway
out...)

LaxSlash1993 · Post by **LaxSlash1993** » Wed Jan 11, 2012 10:30 pm

I think that'd be more work than it's worth. Not only that, but if you screw up, your left with a bad vintage synth. Not saying that it's not possible (although it might not be...), but you'd have to alter the panel, add new circuits, new controls, and change a lot of the wiring.

The KB mod might not be as difficult to do. I'm pretty sure I've heard of people that did similar things with the Model D's.

thealien666 · Post by **thealien666** » Wed Jan 11, 2012 11:22 pm

human fly wrote:...
-to convert it from s-trig to standard gate trig (eg: compatible with roland triggers)
(switchable)...

BTW, if I'm not mistaken, there is already the possibility of using "gate" or "positive pulse" trigger, as in Roland systems, by using a stereo 1/4" jack for CV input. Tip is S-Trigger, Ring is V-Trigger (gate). Same thing for the Trigger Out jack. Have a close look at the back panel of your Rogue under those jacks...

One less mod to do, woohoo!

muksys · Post by **muksys** » Wed Jan 11, 2012 11:42 pm

The keyboard mod should be pretty symple. This place sells a MIDI mod for the rogue, if you'd be interested in something like that. The rest is just pulling it apart and building an enclosure.

As far as the other options, you may be able to find a shop that can do custom mods (Deltronics in Chicago has my Rogue at the moment fixing some issues and adding an LFO rate LED mod), but, I'd agree, it's kinda useless to do that to the Rogue. I do love the sound, but I kinda look at it as a great tool for a couple of sounds. Trying to get it to go beyond what it was designed to do my be a costly endeavor. It might be better to take the money that you would invest in it and get something else. Maybe look for a Moog Prodigy. It's pretty much the big brother of the Rogue. But, here is the Rogue service maual which has the schematic in the back. You may be able to trace out where to insert some CV inputs and/or outputs.

thealien666 · Post by **thealien666** » Thu Jan 12, 2012 12:10 am

Come to think of it, you should have bought an MG-1 instead of a Rogue. It pretty much has everything you want; an LFO with a LED that can even auto-trigger the envelopes, a ring mod (called Bell Tone), separate waveforms and octaves for each OSC, gate (Roland compatible positive pulse) trigger in. And it usually costs less because of the Realistic name (Radio-Shack) but make no mistake it shares the same DNA as the Rogue.
It hasn't got a detachable keyboard though...

Mr Arkadin · Post by **Mr Arkadin** » Thu Jan 12, 2012 5:00 am

human fly wrote: -to remove the keyboard, semi-permanently, allowing me to patch it in
when i want. eg; to turn it into a rackmount cv+gate module, and 'expander',
for other cv+gate gear, and slave it to sequencer, and keep keyboard as a cv+gate
k/b>

You could just get a Taurus II. It's already been done for you. No hack sawing required. You may even find one occasionally without the footpedals, making it a bit cheaper.

human fly wrote: -to convert it from s-trig to standard gate trig (eg: compatible with roland triggers)
(switchable)

As stated by thealien666, V-trig is already in there.

human fly · Post by **human fly** » Sun Jan 15, 2012 2:47 pm

thanks for good replies, confirms my thoughts, eg: worth the hassle?
i know the Prodigy, remember it being 'juicier'. as for the MG1, i picked
this thing up cheap, almost at random, years ago.
when i triggered it from a roladn cv+gate, i think i had to pull the jacks
out halfway to have correct triggering. other than that i have an old
'missing link' cv to midi box that does s-trig as well as others. but i found
it most effective as a slave unti to an mc202: the slides worked, it was
cool. so i was thinking it could be a good cv+gate 'expander'...but yeah,
might be worth trading it in to get a little modern analog thing. but it does
have a very distinctive character, which i could even identify via youtube
vids when compared with the LPhatty>
'heresy' was reference to the notion that 'vintage' should be left untouched;
in this case, i don't think so if it is done by a pro: there's a vca, vcf, 2 vco's,
an lfo, eg, which could all probably be interfaced with other modules - just
idle curiosity really ;]
there are a few mods online relevant to all of these, that seem fairly simple,
listed as Prodigy mods. worht a look..

Mr Arkadin · Post by **Mr Arkadin** » Mon Jan 16, 2012 3:40 pm

human fly wrote:when i triggered it from a roladn cv+gate, i think i had to pull the jacks
out halfway to have correct triggering.

What you should have done of course is use TRS jacks. It's even written on the back of the socket.

thealien666 · Post by **thealien666** » Mon Jan 16, 2012 4:27 pm

Mr Arkadin wrote:
human fly wrote:when i triggered it from a roladn cv+gate, i think i had to pull the jacks
out halfway to have correct triggering.
What you should have done of course is use TRS jacks. It's even written on the back of the socket.

Yeah, I guess reading the back of his Rogue might have been too hard to do, right ?

I could understand feeling like not wanting to go thru a user's manual, but when it's right in your face when you plug a jack ? Common man...

Well, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt and say that maybe the back of his synth is damaged or that the writing might be all worn out...?

Fortunately for him, he can't physically plug in the PSU cable in that trigger jack !

Just kidding... I'm sorry I couldn't help it.

Mr Arkadin · Post by **Mr Arkadin** » Mon Jan 16, 2012 4:42 pm

Well if you're going to talk of modding then a cursory glance at the Rogue circuit diagram might be in order, and it's actually far more common on the internet than the user manual.

thealien666 · Post by **thealien666** » Mon Jan 16, 2012 5:19 pm

Mr Arkadin wrote:Well if you're going to talk of modding then a cursory glance at the Rogue circuit diagram might be in order, and it's actually far more common on the internet than the user manual.

Yes, that's great advice. But you also need to know how to analyze and read schematics.

BTW, the user manual for the Rogue is very easily found on the internet, a 10 seconds search is all it took me.

muksys · Post by **muksys** » Mon Jan 16, 2012 5:54 pm

human fly wrote:t...but yeah,
might be worth trading it in to get a little modern analog thing. but it does
have a very distinctive character, which i could even identify via youtube
vids when compared with the LPhatty

yeah, don't get rid of it! I have both an LP and a Rogue, and there is a definite difference between the two. I love the hard, rough edges of the Rogue. The filter doesn't get as mid-rangey as the LP does, which I like a lot. The LP has the refined polished sound and the rogue sounds gritty & dirty.

BTW, I had that LFO rate LED mod installed. So much easier to dial in specific rate speed, and looks killer. Just an FYI, I took my Rogue in because it had several issues. The filter AMT did not work at all, the MOD Wheel worked on and off, the Pitch Wheel stopped working, the VCO's would drop out of tune if I pressed keys to fast and it was just overall very unstable. They fixed Everything. Replaced an op amp, fixed some broken traces on the circuit board, rewired the pitch & mod wheels and added that LFO rate LED mod. Total coast was just over $200. I'd bet, if you have a repair shop near you, you could get the additional CV IN/OUTS added by a pro for pretty cheap. Then you can open it up, take some pics and post here what they did so I can do it to mine

Mr Arkadin · Post by **Mr Arkadin** » Mon Jan 16, 2012 6:42 pm

thealien666 wrote: BTW, the user manual for the Rogue is very easily found on the internet, a 10 seconds search is all it took me.

Yes it is now, because of the fine work of the people on this board. About a year ago you'd have found nothing. Trust me, I looked.

thealien666 · Post by **thealien666** » Mon Jan 16, 2012 6:56 pm

Mr Arkadin wrote:...because of the fine work of the people on this board...

Yes indeed! Let us thank them very much for it !

human fly · Post by **human fly** » Fri Feb 03, 2012 4:50 pm

thealien666 wrote:
human fly wrote:...
-to convert it from s-trig to standard gate trig (eg: compatible with roland triggers)
(switchable)...
BTW, if I'm not mistaken, there is already the possibility of using "gate" or "positive pulse" trigger, as in Roland systems, by using a stereo 1/4" jack for CV input. Tip is S-Trigger, Ring is V-Trigger (gate). Same thing for the Trigger Out jack. Have a close look at the back panel of your Rogue under those jacks...

One less mod to do, woohoo!

yes, i forgot about this

gonna jack it into the x0xbox:sync, osc1 off, contour

it slides... nice... need to get an accent thing going(assignable)
hahaa, wrote a fantasy list of all the mods this thing could handle...just reading
the other posts....

What you should have done of course is use TRS jacks. It's even written on the back of the socket.

yeah, but i was in a hurry.

truth is, i had forgotten what i did. i posted the question to see what came back, because i used it
a lot for a while and found it a bit dull in mixes-until i triggered it with a gate/accent/slide sequencer.
(i don't think the accents were doing anything to the gate amplitude though), and then it screamed.
not really interested in it's porn-y lead wee-oo sound, but it is unique in the modern synth context:
dirty oscillators, yeah!
i want to exploit the pwm and ring/fm effects, (and was so blown away by the se1x) and have an
analog expander with pedigree to run with cv+gate, i'm not a keyb' player, don't care about that.
removing keyboard is about reducing weight and size, and actually using it instead of having it
sitting in a box. it isn't small for what it does, and has to earn it's keep, spacewise.

the oakly mod is impressive but it's a shame to remove the visual spirit of the unit like that, and
it didn't extend its sonic range. it seems it is possible to separate waveform selection, and have
independent pwm, so it should be possible to clone and add an oscillator, have fm/filter mod etc.
i've done a sim in synthedit, and it worky pretty well, although it is a much bigger synth now and
still doesn't have that 'crazed fan' sound to it. i'm getting pretty sick of computers. (hahaha...)

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