Hi fyvewytches,
In my first post I tried to help with issues that were brought here like renaming of presets and saving banks in the editor that seemed to spark flames. I offered my help with any other problems related to the Voyager editor. Please try me. I would prefer that you contact me or our support directly so customers who need help with the software do not have to read through flames, stuff that I cannot respond to without creating more flames. I just want to help.
Mark,
You are doing what you always do on this list and others… blame other people and don’t address the real issues that they bring up. Instead you revert to name calling and telling people what they do and don’t know.
I have gotten to the point with you and your company that I will continue to go on record to say that you have yet to prove yourself trustworthy. I care about the community here and over at the Kurzweil groups. I don’t like it when software companies come in promising functional software and continually fail to deliver. You are taking money from my brothers and sisters in the music world and not delivering a reliable product.
You don’t like it that I bring up Kurzweil… well it’s a good example to bring up because you are doing the same exact things here, namely offering support on this forum and not really giving us proper software. I did not sign any non-disclosure agreement nor have I said anything here that hasn’t been said online dozens of times by others. Calling me out on this technicality makes it sound like you are trying to hide something. Are you?
I gave you countless number of hours over the years trying to help you debug your software. I do not expect you to fix everything (though thanks for lumping me into a group of people that you can then make generalizations about while slagging me personally). And you tell me that “I got it for free so shouldn’t be complaining”… Me, one of your strongest supporters online for the past 5 years.
I have been working with your Kurzweil software since 2008. At no time during those 5 years have I seen anything close to an acceptable editor (no, I am neither offended nor obsessed, but thanks anyway for trying to psychoanalyze me). And now I’m hearing my brothers and sisters on this forum (okay, mostly bros…) complain about the exact same kinds of problems that I have experienced. You are not delivering a reliable product. Some of the unreliability should have been caught without the help of Beta testers, it was just that awful. But you instead put faulty software out there for us to troubleshoot for you, and then either take years to fix it or worse, never fix it.
I tried to rename a program on the latest Kurzweil editor (released September 2013). Instead of renaming it, the program was deleted. Nor did it ask me to save any changes, it just deleted it out of my keyboard. This is just a small example of things that you should have caught before releasing the software on an unsuspecting world. This is Alpha software, not Beta…
My suggestion, and a way for you to reclaim some of the honour that you’ve let slip:
ONE - Refund EVERYONE who asks for a refund. No questions asked.
TWO - Go ahead and fix the worst of the bugs that are reported. You don’t have to treat your Beta testers like pond scum, they are here to help you. Neither do you have to fix every little last thing that they report. Your Beta testers will be able to rate their bug reports as Minor, Serious, or ‘Stop the Presses!’ don’t ever release a program like this… Trust them, don’t treat them like garbage. Don’t assume that you know what they do and don’t know. In short, don’t be such an arrogant prig.
THREE - Finally, apologize to this list and every other list you’ve been less than trustworthy and honourable with. Suck it up. Stop the personal attacks. Start acting like you care about music and musicians. If you truly can’t do that last thing, they get the hell out of this business and stay out.
And to everyone else, please keep SoundTower’s feet to the fire. If you feel that there is something non-functional about a piece of software that you got from SoundTower, either free or paid for, then say it out loud here on this forum or whatever forum is most appropriate for that particular software. Write to Moog (or whomever) and let them know your experiences with SoundTower. Likewise, if there are things that you appreciate about their software, this is also a good place to speak your mind. Do not, I repeat DO NOT keep the conversation just between you and SoundTower. This is what they want because it keeps people in the dark about their overall non-responsiveness. Keep it public and keep it constant.
With respect to all the hard working musicians out there, both professional and otherwise, Grammy winners and home studio warriors. I still hold out hope that one day SoundTower may too earn our respect.
Stephen
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Xlnt response once the ST guy showed up…and I wholeheartedly agree with the ranting…very frustrating software.. I can move any bank onto Voyager Editor screen, but can’t get it into library. Transmit and receive don’t seem to be working.
However, I have an idea…Hey Mark, or any other ST guy, if you guys are truly contrite about the software issues that we’re all dealing with, and you are interested in squelching the obvious mob mentality that exists here, perhaps there’s a way that we can help each other.
My name is Don…I am available from 8am -12pm @ 310 261-9550 PST 7 days a week…if you call me and personally walk me thru the dynamics of the problem that I just mentioned while I have my Electric Blue and your software both fired up, IN EXCHANGE, I will give you the best damn attaboy on this forum,as well as to Moog themselves.
Trust me, I’ll lay it on thick…here is an opportunity for you to step up to the plate and show some real concern for the people who buy your products…Thanx
Synthetically Yours,
Don S. dravis14
The curious reader might note that Moog no longer uses SoundTower for their editors. The new SubPhatty uses an in-house editor. And it actually works well.
Their actions speak volumes in this case.
Stephen
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Um, now I’m even more confused… 
When I select a bank, by pressing one of the “A”-“G” buttons, and then choose save (either from the menu, or by button press), the stored file will contain exactly the same data, regardless of which of the seven banks I selected before saving. (A binary comparison utility confirms that the files are identical.) Running ‘strings’ on the file will list out the preset names of the presets in bank G, so I assumed that it was saving that bank every time.
Loading one of these files, however, lets me choose which of the seven banks I want to load from the file, and which of the seven banks I want to load it into. This seems to imply that all seven banks are actually stored in the file. For a moment, I thought that was my misunderstanding, and the presence of bank G preset names in clear text was just a coincidence - but you seem to confirm that it’s supposed to save only the currently selected bank.
I’m running version 3.7 of the Windows edition of the Editor.
No offense, but get back to the instrument. Moogs are meant for hands on tweaking, not trying to work out software bugs. The Voyager already has what 100 presets? If that is not enough, just learn the instrument better so everything becomes intuitive. I had the voyager and editor for a while, and never needed it, yet never ran out of things to do and new sounds. Plus the bad energy on this thread is not at all conducive to good music making, unless you count rage metal if that is a thing.
Again, get back to the knobs, keys, and cords, not a computer.
Reminds me of a thread almost 10 years ago 
all true,
just a pity for those who paid for an editor as they have a different way of working with the voyager
Yes, but if they just simply let it go and focus on what is there rather than what is not there, they won’t care. I sold my voyager, and work on a model D, some MF’s, MP-201 and studio gear (as far as synthesis), and after years, I have not run out of new things to do.
The best way to discover sounds IMO is to start simple, a basic sound that you know and that sounds great on its own, and can dial up by ear, and explore from there. When you use presets, you are starting from a different place every time, which can be interesting, but then you rely on it and since you don’t know really what the settings are, you lose the intuition and musicality. Plus diving though menus is completely counter to musical creativity.
The thing is about Moogs, as with most synths, is that even when you think you know everything there is to know about it, if you look at it deeply and creatively enough, you can always find new paths to take. For example, I have been messing with the mixer knobs on the model D in combination with the waveform switches, and using all three oscillators. Even without the filter or envelopes, there is a huge amount of variation you can get. Think about it probabilistically: 3 osc * 5 waveforms and 5 octave settings each and many tuning variations. That itself is huge, but the real variation is when you mix the oscillators at different levels using different waveforms and hit the filter section at different levels.
There is real substance there that may be difficult to see unless you look hard. I used to think the mixer section was the most boring part, but you can really change the sound in interesting ways even using the same exact settings, just mixing the oscillators relative to each other and the filter in new ways. Then you add the filter and its infinite modulations, and you really cannot run of ideas, and especially on the model D, just about everything sounds amazing, so everything besides the basic sound is just the whipped cream on top. When people say the model D is limited, I just laugh at them.
Sorry but you dont get the issue here. For me anyway, it’s not about presets or how many there are. If I need a certain sound, then yes I will use the knobs and switches on the instrument… But when I get to the sound I am looking for, I want to save it. Not because I don’t think I’ll be able to find it again, but simply because I don’t want to waste my time finding it over and over again if I want to play a track. Had it been reliable, I would have used this software as the equivalent to the pencil and paper patch sheet method which has been around for much longer than any “editor”. I really don’t think this editor is supposed to take out the creative side of the instrument, it should be just a tool to make recording of patches easier.
With my Sonic Six, PS-3100, MicroMac, I work with pencil and paper, does that mean I’m being less creative ?
Don’t get mad at me, but I think that is “preset thinking”. Just try to open your mind to this for a second, i am not trying to be right, just helpful. Make it a journey, learn to get to the patch on your own, and get there in a musical way. Gradually morph the basic sound that I referenced in my post into the patch you want. Turning the knobs and getting to where you want to go is amazing, that’s what Moogs are all about IMO, and once you get there even better. That is what I meant by “getting back to the knobs”, you say it is waste of time, I say that is the best part, the only part really. Plus you will have gotten a step closer to mastering the instrument. If you think you have already mastered the instrument, sorry you are wrong. You may know what everything does, but as I said the combinations are infinite, especially on a voyager.
When we find a patch we like, we form an attachment with it, and we feel we have to go back to it. But if you just let it go, and then maybe later try to come back to it through a different path, you find that there are not only beautiful things along that path, but also that you have have found new ways to improve the original patch.
I understand where you are coming from, and I would be angry too, but that doesn’t help anything, trust me. It doesn’t get you anywhere, and ends up hurting you and your creativity. I thought one of the benefits of using analog hardware that we don’t have to worry about computers and software. The more time you spend worrying about software bugs, the less time you have to explore your amazing beautiful analog synthesizer that is just waiting for you to tweak it.
Sorry if this sounds sanctimonious, but I think it’s true.
I have never faced this kind of problem, since you are, I would recommend you to first check your computer settings if they are all set then there is a software problem
Now have a Voyager Yes, yes, happy days etc etc…
Reading this thread about the voyager editor it seems a waste of money buying it if not working properly.
It would have been great as my Anniversary Edition is the 128 presets edition before the stock roll out of the 896 edition. The editor would have been a great idea as I could have stored my presets on computer meaning I there wouldn’t be any need to upgrade to digital system 3.0.
So whats the story with the editor ??
M
p.s. I’m running Mac OS 10.4.11 on PowerPC version
Well the story with the editor is contained within this thread as well as countless others scattered around the Internet.
The general consensus is that it’s rather buggy, as is most if not all of their stuff. Moog has stopped using them and have gone in-house with their editors. Mark from SoundTower has a rather dismal view of people who try to help debug his software for him. He has yet to come up with an editor that works well. I still wish the best for him and hold out hope that one day he will get his stuff together and come out with a decent editor. I know he is capable of it… Currently he is taking people’s hard earned money and not delivering a solid product.
TBH, the additional presets are nice but not going to stop you from making good music if you don’t have them.
Stephen
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Guess definitely will wait then to get an editor, hopefully Amos (the tech whizz) Gaynes has been following and will
eventually redo an in-house Editor/Librarian for the voyager. (Amos ??)
In terms of creating good music, no need for the editor to be able to do that, it will be handy to store actual presets when ROM is limited (as in my case to 128 preset banks), so you can call back presets if you overwrite them with your own and then without loss of your newly created ones (as back up will have been created).
The editor idea works great for and with the Sub Phatty (Sub Phattae only has 16 banks).
M
You can save patches or entire banks without the use of an editor. Use MidiOx to recieve and send the sysex to/from your computer.
XL resolved it…
Doh ! 
Of course..! (Slaps forehead!) 
I’m getting ready to purchase an RME…I have also had “interesting” experiences with ST editors before for DSI synths, one time losing all my patches
All I care about is the librarian functions…backing up my own patches. Sysex is a poor workaround as it’s much more difficult to audition patches and set up new banks but I’ll deal with it if the editor is as bad as people here say.
Good luck with that…
Stephen
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