A feature which i use a lot is the latch function to drone notes whilst i tweak my drum machine etc… I am using the [LATCH ON] button on the ADSR to do this, however if in duo mode then this only latches one of the notes, determined by the [KB CTRL]. I have been searching through the manual and various forums and cant find any reference to how to get both oscilators to latch on different notes. This seems not a problem for most poly synths and I woudl be amazed if it is not a frature of the sub 37, i just cant seem to find the right sub menu…
Some of the time i can just make a sequence and that works fine, but if i want to improvise more with the harmony then i really want to be able to latch the two notes seperately. Any help would be much appreciated!
EDIT: i noticed that it is the same with the release aspect of the envelope. If i am playing both oscillators separately and let go at the same time then only one note will keep sounding, played by both oscilators. I am wondering if this is an aspect of the Duophonic synths sharing a filter thing? Any thoughts / advice much appreciated!
Yep, definately not the problem. I can play both oscilators seperately ok, however when i take my hands off the keys only one note continues to latch, played by both oscilators. If is is relevant i have got [MULT TRIG] and [RESET] active on the adsr.
Yeah from memory I get the same thing, but I’m never entirely sure, I haven’t isolated it from other things going on. Sounds like you’ve been through the menu settings as well.
Hopefully Amos or other will respond? Maybe bring it up in firmware thread?
The key thing to understand is that the Sub 37 is not polyphonic, it’s paraphonic. There is only one filter and one final amp. But, the issue you’re having has far less to do with either the filter or the amp. It’s more about pitch.
When you hold two notes (and are in DUO MODE) each oscillator has its own pitch. When you release one of the keys, both of the oscillators track that single remaining key. You’re not hearing one of the oscillators cut off via the volume or filter, you’re just hearing the oscillator rapidly jump to the other note.
Here’s a link to a post where I explain it in greater detail:
Thanks for your reply, and for the link. It makes a lot more sense now why the two notes dont have their own release times. The only part i am still confused on is why when latching they do not both sound, as they both are clearly capable of sustaining independently even if separate release is not possible due to the pitch jumping to join whichever was release fractionally later. I had assumed that latch just meant the key release (and therefore the triggering of the ‘release’ stage of the ADSR) was ignored, however this was just an assumption, I don’t actually know how it works!
Thats cool, i get that aspect of it. I guess i dont full understand how ‘latch’ works as i had assumed it took place before the release so the order of release was unimportant due to it not actually happening.
I expected it to work in the following way [with latch on]
1st note press/latch: osc 1 + osc 2 play same note
2nd note press/latch, still holding original note: osc 1 original note, osc 2 note 2
3rd note press/latch, still holding 2nd note: osc 2 note 2, osc 1 note 3
etc…
(sorry, perhaps slightly confusingly put, let me know if i should reword!)
I get why both oscs jump to one note due to the shared envelope but i dont understand why the release is relevant with latch being used.
You are making mental connections between parts of an analog synthesizer that simply do not exist.
As stated in the link I gave you above, oscillators are always on. They don’t switch on/off based on any envelopes (filter or amp), they’re just always going.
Since all OSCILLATORS in the Sub 37 go from the MIXER to the FILTER to the final AMPLIFIER, it might initially seem like the FILTER EG and AMPLIFIER EG are turning the OSCILLATORS on/off. But you’ll just have to trust me that OSC 1, OSC 2, SUB OSC, and NOISE are always going.
All that the FILTER LATCH does is fool the FILTER EG into thinking that the GATE is on (and nothing else).
All that the AMP LATCH does is fool the AMP EG into thinking that the GATE is on (and nothing else).
Neither of the LATCH buttons have anything to do with the OSCILLATORS or their pitch.
Neither of the LATCH buttons have anything to do with what keys have recently been pressed.
(LATCH is NOT a SUSTAIN PEDAL, it only affects the GATE for each ENVELOPE.)
Plugging a sustain pedal into the KB gate works. I always rock a sustain pedal on poly’s. I also have a Moog Expression pedal I use for all my instruments, I REALLLY recommend one of those to free up your hands.
Sustain Pedal into the KB Gate works, but the pedal needs to be the correct polarity (or it will work in reverse, sustaining notes while it is not depressed).
But it still won’t create the behavior you want out of Duo Mode in the OP. I just hooked up a sustain pedal and tried, but the Sub37 does what Dan describes, where one of the OSCs will jump over to the other note when you lift your fingers off the keyboard, and the pedal will sustain that note (not both). Oh well.
Just for a mental exercise, try to describe the behavior (in writing) that you’d rather have when you go from playing two keys to then only playing one key.
I think what you’ll discover is that there would then be a major performance problem if a second note was always stuck on the last pitch it was playing (the last time you held two notes).
In other words: How would the Sub 37 know that you were playing one note because you wanted one note, instead of you playing one note because you wanted two notes playing with the old note still stuck on?
And then, what would the behavior be for the stuck note if you kept playing single notes for a while?
