[SPH] Sub Phatty firmware 2.1.12 available

The Moog Forum Moog Beta Forum
21

Thanks, I have it working now and it makes sense.

I get a “Hardware not connected” message in the VST quite often, and I have to quit Sonar, restart the SPH, use the standalone editor to get the hardware connected, and then try again with the VST. That often works but sometimes I have to reboot the PC, connect with the stand alone editor first, and then launch Sonar to get the VST to find the hardware.

I can fumble along with that for now, as I understand there is a new version of the VST on the horizon. If it keeps happening with the new version I’ll try and document it more carefully.

22

Hello robotecho, and thanks for the feedback.

Let me see if I get you correctly -

  • You can connect the hardware both using VST and VSTi in Sonar (Windows)
  • While using VST/VSTi, the hardware disconnects automatically every once in a while ?
  • To make the plugin see the hardware, you first load the standalone and then close it and load VST/VSTi in Sonar ?

Can you try using a different USB cable and ports, and remove/reinstall the SPH drivers ?

23

Thanks Gil,

Sorry my last post was a bit rushed. I’ll try and describe the issue more accurately.

  • I can only install the VST in Sonar. The VSTi remains undetected by Sonar, which I gather is a known issue. As I understand it, the VSTi won’t make a big difference for me, so I am not as bothered about this as I was.

  • If I follow these steps, as far as I can tell the VST does not see the hardware, and always gives a “Hardware dosconnected” message.
    – Computer is running.
    – Power on SPH.
    – Start up Sonar and open project with an instance of Sub Phatty editor VST.
    – Open editor VST, click on “prefs”.
    – Note hardware disconnected message, no midi values set.

  • If I follow these steps, sometimes the VST can connect to the hardware.
    – Close Sonar.
    – Power off SPH, wait 10 seconds.
    – Power on SPH, wait 10 seconds.
    – Start stand alone editor.
    – Click on prefs, note hardware is connected, shows 2.1.12 version, shows midi values.
    – Close stand alone editor.
    – Start up Sonar and open project with an instance of Sub Phatty editor VST.
    – Open editor VST, click on “prefs”.
    – Sometimes hardware is connected.

If not, this usually works:
– Reboot computer.
– Power on SPH, wait 10 seconds.
– Start stand alone editor.
– Click on prefs, note hardware is connected, shows 2.1.12 version, shows midi values.
– Close stand alone editor.
– Start up Sonar and open project with an instance of Sub Phatty editor VST.
– Open editor VST, click on “prefs”.
– Hardware is connected, shows 2.1.12 version, shows midi values.

NOTE: I tested this to make sure, and this time it didn’t work. So while in Sonar I powered off the SPH, deleted the instance of the VST, then powered on the SPH, added a new instance of the VST, and that worked.

Note that once I have the VST working, it seems to work fine and uninterrupted in Sonar, as expected.

Hope that is clear. I connecting via a USB hub, so I’ll try and connect directly to a port on the motherboard with a different cable, reinstall all drivers, and report back on the issue.

EDIT:

Attempting to step through this process today, I ran into a lot of issues and strange behaviour. It is a bit hard to document everything exactly, but if I had to characterise it, I would say it appeared that the VST was fighting for control with the SPH as a controller. At one point I was able to have a midi track with input from my A800 PRO controller, and output to an instance of the VST, and play the synth, which I thought I had established was not possible.

I reinstalled the driver, VST and firmware. I eventually stabilised it and got expected behaviour by first only using the SPH as a controller with no instance of the VST, then adding the VST and following the steps above.

Reading through the purpose of the USB driver, which is to allow control of the SPH by both the plugin and as a controller in the DAW, it seems like I may have an issue there.

24

Thanks for clarifying.

I have tested the scenarios you’ve mentioned, and here it’s always connected, as long as the midi ports under PREF are set correctly (i.e both are set to the SPH drivers).

I did, however, get to a point on which I could see the version numbers (i.e "connected), but the plugin didn’t control the synth, and it worked only the other way around.

Can you try uninstalling the drivers, then manually deleting them from Windows\System32\Drivers (if remained), reinstall the drivers, connect to a different USB port using a different cable, and try again ?

25

Hi Gil, appreciate your help with this.

Below is the result of my testing today, it is long and detailed but was accurately recorded as I tested, so might prove valuable.

The TL;DR version:
It seems that if I add the plugin to a project and save it, when I reopen that project the VST does not connect to the hardware, and if I delete it and insert a new instance this will not connect to the hardware either.

However if I delete the instance of the plugin before saving the project, and then insert a new instance when I open the project, this appears to connect and work normally.

Apparently most of the other steps I have been taking may have occasionally worked but are not reliable.

Using the method of deleting the plugin before saving, then adding it again next time I opened the project, was repeatably successful 3 times without power cycling the SPH and after a reboot.

This gives me a usable workaround, I hope the rest of the information is useful to you.

Cheers, Rob.

  • With the SPH powered down I have swapped out the USB cable and connected to a USB port on the motherboard.
  • I have uninstalled the USB driver and checked Windows\System32\Drivers and found the driver file had been removed.
  • Rebooted my PC, powered on the SPH, run the install for the USB driver, completed successfully.

    \
  • Launched Sonar, and set the VST to run as an effect. I have had it running as a synth (VSTi), which I can see might cause unexpected behaviour.
  • Ensured that the Moog Sub Phatty is NOT selected as a midi controller in Sonar preferences.
  • Created a new project with a basic template.
  • Insert the SPH Editor VST in the audio track and open for editing.
  • Hardware not connected, but “2- Moog Sub Phatty” selected as midi input/output in prefs. Device is now identified as “3 - Moog Sub Phatty” after driver reinstall. Selecting “3 - Moog Sub Phatty” as midi input/output connects as expected.
  • Set “Local Control” to on, plugin works as expected, all good.
  • Save project as ‘drivertest’, close Sonar.

    \
  • Power down SPH, wait 20 seconds, power up SPH, wait 20 seconds.
  • Launch Sonar, open saved project ‘drivertest’.
  • Open editor, hardware disconnected, “3 - Moog Sub Phatty” set as midi in/out.
  • Close Sonar.
  • Open stand alone editor, set “3 - Moog Sub Phatty”, hardware disconnected.
  • Power down SPH, wait 20 seconds, power up SPH, wait 20 seconds.
  • Open stand alone editor, hardware is connected.
  • Launch Sonar, open saved project ‘drivertest’, open editor, hardware disconnected.
  • Delete instance of VST, insert new instance of VST, hardware disconnected.
  • Close Sonar, power down SPH, reboot PC.

    \
  • Power on SPH, launch stand alone editor, hardware is connected. Close stand alone editor.
  • Launch Sonar, open saved project ‘drivertest’, open editor, hardware disconnected.
  • Delete instance of VST, insert new instance of VST, hardware disconnected.
  • Close Sonar.

    \
  • Power down SPH, wait 20 seconds, power up SPH, wait 20 seconds.
  • Lauch Sonar, creat a new project with a basic template.
  • Insert the SPH Editor VST in the audio track and open for editing.
  • Hardware is connected, VST works as expected.
  • Attempt to open saved project ‘drivertest’.
  • Error message:

Moog Sub Phatty : Could not connect to Sub Phatty MidiPortHandler !
Please make sure that the file
c:\Users\rob\AppData\Roaming\Moog Music Inc.\Sub Phatty\Sub Phatty MidiPortHandler.exe is present on your computer.

This is possibly expected? Maybe you can’t have two projects with instances of the VST running at the same time?

  • Click OK.
  • Saved project ‘drivertest’ opens.
  • Open VST, get ‘start by selecting…’ message.
  • Attempt to set midi input to “3 - Moog Sub Phatty”, get message:

“Could not open MIDI input ‘3- Moog Sub Phatty In’”

Again, possibly expected.

  • Close Sonar.


    \
  • Power down SPH, wait 20 seconds, power up SPH, wait 20 seconds.
  • Launch Sonar, open saved project ‘drivertest’, open editor, hardware disconnected.
  • Delete VST instance, save, close Sonar.


    \
  • Power down SPH, wait 20 seconds, power up SPH, wait 20 seconds.
  • Launch Sonar, open saved project ‘drivertest’.
  • Insert Editor VST, open, hardware is connected.
  • Open Sonar preferences, add SPH as midi input/output device.
  • Create midi track and set SPH as midi input/output device.
  • SPH is controlled as expected from midi channel, VST controls SPH as expected, both can be used at same time, all good.
  • Delete instance of VST and save project ‘drivertest’.
  • Close Sonar.

    \
  • Launch Sonar (no power cycle of SPH this time).
  • Open saved project ‘drivertest’.
  • Insert Editor VST, open, hardware is connected.
  • SPH is controlled as expected from midi track, VST controls SPH as expected, both can be used at same time, all good.
26

Thanks for the extremely detailed report! We might want to teamview and see what it is about, lets keep this going on email.

27

Sure thing Gil, email or PM me, happy to help.

28

Is there a way to roll back the firmware? Ever since I updated my MIDI out in Abeton only gives the option for SuB Phatty Out and when I try and send MIDI data to the Phatty it plays erroneous notes.

29

I can’t see in your signature what kind of system you are using. In case it is Windows - have you installed the latest driver ? did you follow all steps noted above carefully ?

30

I updated my sig block. Yes I followed the instruction to the letter. I found an earlier firmware and re-installed that and it works fine again.

31

If you can install latest version again, and see if you get the same issue again, it will let us know if this was a specific issue for v2.1.12, or reinstalling is all that was needed.

32

After updating to v2.1.12 the problem with glitched/dropped notes (https://forum.moogmusic.com/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=27671) is gone. Nice.

33

I am still having this issue.

34

Hi,

Which issue are you referring to ? is that on firmware or Editor ?

We plan to go back to SPH development as soon as we release MTRE, which is expected very soon.

35

I was referring to the dropped notes issue. However, i read that it might possibly be solved with the use of a sysex tool which eradicates leftovers from previous firmwares. I would be very interested to try that out..
Good to hear that work on the Sub Phatty firmware/editor will be resumed shortly :slight_smile:

36

Hi guys

I opened a thread in the normal forum also but maybe the Dev´s can help me
with this or implement it in the firmware :slight_smile:

Iam triggering my SubPhatty with CV 1V/Octave from my DAW via MOTU Ultralite MK3 Soundcard.
Its working well but I want to shift the octave internaly in the SubPhatty.
I can only play 4 octaves in the middle from C2 maybe.
Does somebody know if its possible to shift the octaves in the SubPhatty that I can trigger the
high or very low octaves with CV.

Thank you

ahhhhmmmm…I tried it again and it worked in some other way
The last note which iam playing on the keyboard from the Subphatty is the lowest note which I can trigger via CV.
That is cool but it would be great to set the SubPhatty on external trigger only and to shift the octave in the editor.

37

Hello Robotecho,

We need to know if any of the issues you reported still happen to you using latest 2.0.0b6,

Please let us know. Thanks!

38

This was March 27th:

Any news on this? Thanks, greets

39

What is taking so long to release the firmware for the SPH?
Is there no information like a roadmap or a timetable available for us beta people?