Anyone agree that the new Voyager is way over priced ? and that people who want to take a giant step backwards want the model D with a more reasonable price ? These Elitists at Moog Music have their heads on backwards.
Bring back the Model D with a $2k Retail price and maybe you will sell some units.
These Voyagers are not moving, at our store one came in and we had to sell it one year later as a demo, we will not be ordering anymore.
flame away
Are you kidding? Please, go start a flame war somewhere else, you’re not welcome here.
Not selling the Voyager may have to do with marketing for your store, not the synth. They aren’t going to sell like Korgs or Yamahas.
why should we market them ? they are over priced , We can’t keep the ION in stock but the Voyager collected dust , now the Elitists at Moog have a Upgrade that will cost you plenty.
Moog is a cult for people with their heads on backwards.Moog Voyager is a over priced failure.
how many units have sold ?
Whining about why Moog won’t make a cheap Model D makes as much sense as whining about why Porsche won’t make a cheap Turbo Carrera.
Or maybe Porsche is a cult for people with their heads on backwards (gee, how do they drive?).
How many cars has Porsche sold? By comparison, the Hyundai dealer in my neighborhood can’t seem to keep their cars in stock…
Must be another over-priced failure.
What you need to do is cut the price to $2500. That could draw a few more takers.
Besides, people spend much more than that on a custom modular synth. Those are, at most, duophonic. You should use that as part of your selling point.
Ions sell lots because they are cheap not because they are better synths than the Moog. My money is on the Voyager lasting 30+ years while the Ion will most likely be a dead piece of crap in 5. $3000 for something that will last you a LONG time is really not that bad. Plus it sounds, looks, feels and plays so beautifully. I’m pretty sure it’s selling well anyway so I wouldn’t call it a failure. There are plenty of “Elitists” out there. I’m one of them 
Hmm,
sure they’re a bit expensive - but so what? Many other instruments are not cheap at all. If people can’t afford it they can always look for something else.
moog is the porsche of synths.
i am not going to engage in whining or flaming.
i own a voyager and i love its sound and looks. it is truly a masterpiece.
is it overpriced? depends on your veiwpoint. straight out of the box i would say yes it is. why?
let me tell you why: when i bought it, i thought it was fully functional. after os updates the touchscreen died inexplicably and no tip from here (including rude ones) or moog music could help. the pb wheel didn’t do what it said in the manual. after ordering it i had to wait and received it whopping 6 months later. being a uk model, it did not have a badge from moog.
i had to re-ship it to turnkey in london, and could get a price reduction for the fixes and shipping - only with a lot - a lot - of arguing and correspondence.
i don’t use it so much. the memory of this hassle gives me bad vibes.
would i buy it again? no. for this price i would go for a modular system, one of the many hi quality systems on the market now.
i was and still am a big fan of all things moog, from wendy carlos “switched on bach” to the new products made by moog music.
but this was just not what i expected. you can get used voyagers for nearly half the price for a new one (when i bought it cost over 2000 squids).
plus, the synthesizer itself is incomplete. you are forced to by the break out box to have the outs available. i have come to dislike this concept.
i met bob moog in london when he was at the moog event, and i asked him to sign my invitation email which he did. now that he’s no longer with us i am glad i got the chance to see him in london.
he was such a nice guy and had time to chat with his fans. somehow, my experience with the voyager purchase did not mirror the experience of meeting bob - and that makes me sad.
as i said, i don’t intend to flame or whine and i hope that my points don’t come across that way. by comparison, if i may compare, i have owned many other synths, all of them way cheaper. none have ever had a pitch bend maladjustment or simply had malfunctions in vital areas. a 2000 pound synth that has a pitch bend tracking problem? come on. sorry, i have no interest in that.
i am going to keep my voyager - because it does sound great and is a treasured machine made by the moogies. but functionwise there are synths out there that’ll give you more flexibility for the buck. modulars for instance.
my 2 and a half cents
martn
Perhaps the problem is not so much that customers who come into your store won’t buy the Voyager so much as the negative attitude of the sales people–combined with their inability to sell products–results in poor sales.
I would suggest that your synth salespeople be given classes in how to sell (maybe take some workshops in NLP, for example) and better training in comparing features and quality of different synthesizers.
The fact is, its the job of salespeople to SELL the products they have. If they are incapable of doing so, they should get jobs more befitting their sales skills. Suede, can you say, “Would you like fries with your burger?”
“at you need to do is cut the price to $2500. That could draw a few more takers.”
this quote from one of the posters above answers exactly to what the original poster was talking about: the voyager does show a slight streak of overpricedness, to put it mildly.
it does seem to me that price is an issue for many potential takers. as far as the range of functions and the flexibility of the voyager is concerned, i believe it is in some ways more restricted than a decent modular system in approximately the same price range.
ok, it may not be fair to compare a modular system with the voyager. it’s not even fair to compare it to a model d, i guess.
still, bottom line (for me) is, although the instrument is as sturdy as a tank and will last for many years, it is quite overpriced.
martin
[quote]why should we market them ? they are over priced
This, I think, says it in a nutshell. With this attitude regarding the Voyager, it will be difficult to sell the unit unless someone comes in specifically to purchase one. If there is another store in town that handles Moog that has a better attitude, I would elect to purchase there.
Having said that, we only have one store in our town that has one in stock. It has been in stock for a long time, too. At least the keyboard manager is not all down on the product. He is quite excited about Moog and is thrilled to let you play it. He is very enthusiastic.
In a town as big as Portland, you really have to search to find anybody selling analog synths. In addition to the one Voyager there is one PolyEvolver rack and one PolyEvolver Keyboard. That is it for analog keyboards in all the music shops in this town.
Lets face it–there is only a certain kind of buyer that is looking for a monophonic keyboard that retails for $3,000. You can buy an 88 weighted key full disco Korg, Yamaha, or Roland for that amount. This is what the majority of keyboard players are looking for, expecially if they have a limited budget. If I was looking to buy ONE keyboard and it was between a Triton and a Voyager, I would buy the Triton.
However, if you are looking for something to fill out your keyboard quiver, the Moog is a great option. Nothing else sounds like it. The above named digitals can do filter sweeps which is cool…until you compare it to a Moog filter sweep. No comparison.
Moogs just have “that sound”. My Mini is still my favorite keyboard. When I take people up to see my studio, the sounds that get the oohs and aahs come from the Mini.
Voyagers are built well (sorry Martin–you got a lemon), sound amazing, can be used as a basis for a modular, and let’s face it…they have quite a pedigree.
I like the statement that they are like a Porche. Fords are great and they sell tons of them, but when you need a Porche, nothing else will do. I don’t think that the Porche salespeople tell you that they are elitist and overpriced…
First of all, martin, I want to thank you for expressing your view point in a coherent and non-offensive manner. Discussion is good, flaming is bad and threads like these are obviously ploys to rile people up.
That said, I think we can all agree and understand that the Voyager is expensive, but I really don’t see how anyone can say that it is overpriced. Do any of us really know how much they cost Moog to produce? What their overhead is? What their profit margins are? What a small company really does when making a modern analog synthesizer? No.
Also, the thing about capitalism is that items set thier own price. If something was truely overpriced, the company would reduce the price, as Moog has done a few times. These things started at around $3000 each, now they are much less. I wouldn’t pay $3000, $2400 was my limit and thats what I paid. Any more would be “over” my “price”.
My point is that “overpriced” is a term relative to the buyer, it may cost more then they are willing to pay for what they think it can do for them. And that debates like this are pointless
Martin…
Sorry, but I don’t agree with your reasoning in your last post.
What new keyboard isn’t discounted 15 to 25% from retail price at most music stores? They do it on Korgs. They do it on Yamahas. They do it on Rolands. Fender and Gibson guitars are all discounted. Virtually EVERYTHING in a music store is discounted. Does that mean that all those items are overpriced? I feel sorry for the small mom and pop stores. It is a tough biz to make a living in these days.
You can get a small .com modular for $2,500 that is similar to a Mini. But wait–it doesn’t have a keyboard. I am certainly not putting down the .com product–I intend to purchase a larger unit some day. But I have a friend that is a very knowledgable EE that is a synth freak and he maintains that the Voyager is built much better. A .com is a great deal because it is sold directly–no music store markup. Yet it is still not that much different in price from a Mini. Price a Buchla!! Most modulars that I have priced are quite expensive.
True, the Voyager would have probably sold better if it sold for $2,000 which was the target price for the Big Briar version when the concept for the Voyager was coming out. This was pre touchpad and before presets.
Heck the original Mini sold for something like $1,750 thirty years ago. Keeping inflation in mind the Voyager is a better deal today!!
agreed - it is comparable to a porsche. the quality of the synthesizer is just awesome. try twiddling the knobs, listening to the killer filter through a good monitoring system. it just kicks butt.
had i not received a lemon, i would be quite a bit more positive about it. the fact that there were early models that were shipped to the uk (i don’t know if other countries received these buggy units) made me doubt very much that i had made a good purchse decision. probably this occurred to other users, too.
i don`t understand why these instruments were shipped in such an unfinished state. it just doesn’t make sense. plus, it justifies my point that the voyagers are overpriced.
oh - another thing. the warranty times of the performer and signature editions were very different, same with the price. why? because of the signature? ok, that’s fine if you want the signature. but paying 1000 quid for it? i got a signature from the good doctor in london, and it cost me nothing. just had to ask for it.
yet, the warranty time for a sig is 4 years and for the performer only one, although they are technically identical. just because i had ordered a performer, i only got 1 years’ warranty - by this time there were a couple os updates. only after installing all the updates did some issues and problems creep up. that made me doubt my decision again. I am still waiting for a nice word, an apology, something. it was all a big fight, just to get it up to shape. plus i had to cough up more cash. why?
as for selling the synthesizer in a shop, it should indeed be presented by an enthusiast, someone who knows what it can do. it should receive a special room and be connected to decent speakers and headphones and fx. and you should be allowed to try it out in a special moog booth so no one can disturb you while you try it out.
as i said before, i like the sound of this baby, and i think it would have been a good decision. but why did it have to be such a fight?
martin
The Voyager only appears to be overpriced if you just check the number of knobs and the list of synth features. But the value of nice sound, great UI, beautifull wooden (not plastic!) housing with some parts in metal. Real analogue envelopes - not digital generated envelopes - that drive the filter straight and without a D/A converter like on so many other synths.
The Voyager was shocking expensive for me too. Till I was sitting in front of one. Then I knew, that it is an INSTRUMENT (not an apparatus) in the class of a real Minimoog (I own one too).
If one don’t cares for these points, then you just don’t need to save on the Voyager.
my reasoning is quite simple - again, without wanting to diminish the good moog name, any synthesizer that costs 2000 uk pounds and still has a defect such as with the pich bend is overpriced, period. it should not have such issues. pitch bending is no new technology. it has been around for a while. i just think it should have never left the factory. i am still under the impression that the uk units were shipped untested and/or unfixed.
and when i am asked to pay for shipment to have a “voluntary upgrade” done and pay for this “voluntary upgrade” too, then that is unacceptable for this price.
on the upside, the instrument has the best sound of any synthesizer i have ever owned. it doesn’t even need effects. that’s how good it is. it looks beautiful, the knobs are smooth and sturdy, and the whole thing is just fun to play around with.
regarding modulars - even if a dotcom hasnt’t got a keyboard, that would still not be an issue. controller keyboards are available in abundance. and modules that are broken can be easily replaced. shipping a moog voyager is a big deal.
martin
Can you explain what you mean here? Is it the fact the the first Voyagers had bugs? Well ALL companies, whether they make hardware or software, release products that still have bugs, its a fact of life. It is unavoidable, you can’t catch everything. Future updates (hardware and software) solve the problems initial models had. That is just how the electronics world works.
Or is that the Voyager doesn’t have CV outputs? I saw in an interview that Bob left them off to keep the price down. Makes sense to me, as not everyone will want modular capabilities.
Martin,
Gotcha!!
From what I am understanding, you are saying that you would not consider the Voyager overpriced if yours had come working properly. Too bad you had such a bad experience. Sounds like maybe they could have handled your situation differently.
OVERALL, however, you have got to admit that while it is expensive, the Voyager is not priced that far out of line for what it is; a specialized analog synth that is made in relatively small quantities.
Now another bone to pick with you…
Have you ever seen the box that a 44 space .com synthesizer comes in? Certainly individual or small groups of modules can be shipped much easier than a Mini, but if you buy a complete 22 or 44 rack model, the shipping box is HUGE.
Just having some lively debate with you Martin. As one other poster said on this thread, you have been a well spoken gentleman throughout…