Midi Patchbay

The Moog Forum Moog Music General Topics Forum
1

Guys,
I’ve been wining about this for years now only to have it fall on deaf ears. I’ve written to major companies, companies that have come close, companies that are in the thick of it and so being that the product would compliment their line, etc. But all I get back is…

Crickets.

Now, Dr. Bob would most likely really understand the need here and probably push for something - because he was so savy to the needs of musician when it came to performance.

“Get on with it, man!”

Ok… sorry. JL Cooper Midi Patchbay. Digital Music Corp MX-8. These are the only 2 units ever produced (that I know of…) that not only perform the re-routing of midi devices as well as some merging, filtering, AND here’s the critical one now… SEND PATCH CHANGE code down the pike of each port to each device. Now, the current problem is that today’s midi devices use BANKS to store their patches. But it so doing, the old products mentioned above are no longer effective in midi rigs because the don’t pass along this information. And no, the MOTU line does NOT have this feature without having to drag a computer into the system, and only a MAC at that. This needs to be stand alone.

Guys, the ability to stomp on a single button on a device and have it re-route your midi cables, merge 2 outputs into one so you can have 2 different keyboards access the same sound module… AND have it change the patch on ALL of your midi stuff ALL AT ONCE is SO valuable - probably the most important piece of equipment in my rig. Or, at least it was when it did all of this.

There IS a German company producing a unit that does this job effectively complete with touchpad remote control, but it has a whole bunch of whistles and bells that have only driven the price up to just about 3 grand. The company is MidiTemp and the product is the MultiStation MS-X. But it’s overkill.

And so here I am… wining and complaining again hoping that you guys will agree with me and stand up and scream, “YES WE NEED THAT!”. Moog Music is the ONLY company that I know if that actually LISTENS to it’s customers and tries to see to their needs.

Who knows? If enough people express the need, perhaps Moog Music would come out with a nice 8X8 unit that can do the job correctly at a price we can all afford.

Whether you perform live or not, would a device that does all of this at a reasonable price be valuable??

So come on guys… stand up and scream (please!).

2

I am using a Philip Rees 2M Midi merge unit myself (2 IN/2 OUT/2 THRU) and these units are really fantastic and send all Sysex data, MTC & Pitch bend data/summing.

The only problem is that they are also not made anymore but can still be found on e-bay and such.

They also made 5 IN/1 OUT & 9 IN/1 OUT units.

Check also : http://www.philrees.co.uk/products/mergebox.htm

3

What’s MIDI?
(My rig is so old and limited in it’s MIDI implementation, I can barely fathom what you are asking for!)
All I use MIDI for is to drive the MKS-20 from the JX-3P or the Piano. Or as a clock signal to my recorder. (I don’t have a computer in my studio and haven’t had MIDI on any computer since I sold my Atari Mega 4 back in the early 90’s and it’s stand full of Ensoniq machines.)
I’m glad you understand it, but it is black arts to me! I can’t even send or recieve patch info. Never figured out how.

4

I can’t imagine a Moog product doing MIDI like that? There was an old MIDI interface some company made for the C-64 that did most of that, except it only had one MIDI in so there was no merge function. But the idea was you hit a program change on your master keyboard and programed in the seperate patch changes for up to 4 MIDI outs. Can’t remember who made that one?

Oh right! It was the Moog Songproducer! Had 4 programs to choose from, and the one, “MIDI Command” did almost what you seek. I guess back in the day they figured you would just need an 88 key controller and setup splits for the various MIDI outs. The Moog did all of this back in 1984.

Today you could use a notebook with a USB MIDI interface to get something similar. I never tried, but I thought the program MIDIOX that Moog recommends for Voyager SYSEX transfers could do all of this?
I recently purchased one of those Asus EEE notebooks for around $300USD, and it seems to run many MIDI software progs without any problems, including MIDIOX. Small portable, with a USB MIDI box, almost self contained. I am fooling around with software for the Moog Modular right now. Nothing like having presets on a modular. :laughing:

5

Oh, for crying out loud, CZ. :laughing: I think that the hardware suggested would be useful for people who extensively use MIDI. I just ue it for patch sharing and OS updating, and sometimes to control Garage Band. But, to each his own.

6

I think a point is being missed here.
While I don’t know if John is a live player, what he’s describing is extremely useful in that particular context.
I don’t see a huge need for it in the studio either and of course, a computer can help out there.
But for live players, I completely understand.

What I don’t understand is where someone asks for advice or input and a reply has nothing to do with their situation or is just some guess.
I don’t comment on things I know little about, so I don’t understand why others do.
Maybe “good intentions” or unrelated personal experience outweighs practical help?

If so, here’s my 2 cents: make sure you thoroughly brown the beef prior to making the tacos.
Hope this was helpful. :wink:

7

Point well taken on this end. :blush: I agree that a MIDI patchbay would definitely be useful for live applications when working with multiple synths/computers. Just because it doesn’t meet my PERSONAL needs, doesn’t mean there is no use for it.

So let me clarify my original post. A MIDI patchbay would be a great thing for a lot of people.

8

Hey, let’s not forget the old MIDI master keyboards. Some of those did the seperate patch change out multi MIDI ports with one push of a program button. Some even had an up/down foot switch to change patches on the fly no hands. I have such a device, the Cheetah 5V masterseries. This one has 4 MIDI outs plus an input that could be merged, and a five octave keyboard. I actually shortened one to 2 1/2 oct. (DIY) for a live performance where it was controlling a MAQ 16/3. The keyboard would transpose the sequence, the foot switch would change the sequence, and one of the three wheels was assigned to sequence length. So pulling the wheel down would result in a one note sequence, adding notes up to 16 as it was pushed forward. Not a bad use of MIDI?
So maybe a 5 or 6 octave Moog Master controller with multi MIDI in/outs and a touch pad or joystick, or ribbon controller. Along with those MIDI merge, prog send features? I could use one of those with my poly Voyager. :slight_smile:

PS: Tried the MIDIOX. Does everything but merge incoming MIDI. :frowning:

9

I have two JL Cooper MSB’s in my rig and they are essential to my MIDI system. My rigs see stage and studio work, and the MSBs are great for re-patching without moving MIDI cables. When recording I can patch any controller I want without re-wiring - MIDIBoard for weighted action, Hammond for organ action, drum trigger kit, bass pedals, even a guitar-to-MIDI converter. Seriously underrated units.

10

you have cheetah mkvs, I just got one on ebay- what kind of power supplies do they use? the guy I bought it from seems sketchy- he says he plugged it in and it “sounds good,” but he obvsly didn’t because it’s just a controller, right? and he can’t tell me what type of power supply it takes!! alas

11

I have no idea what the proper supply looked like, or a replacement?

The one I have was a sloppy homemade splice to 9V 500 mA wall wart. I ended up putting a standard barrel type jack on the back of the shortened one. Here is a pic of the original back,inside,homemade plug with pinout. Not sure if that is correct, but what I received? I only paid a few bucks for both so I was not worried about it, but they both power up with that configuration.

12

I’ve posted some MIDI Mergers here:

http://www.moogmusic.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6537

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i want one

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To the original poster: I used a Roland A-880 for many years which doesn’t send BS and PC itself but I do know how useful it is to repatch midi gear whenever you want. You might find a second hand MPC2500 with 2 midi in and 4 midi out useful for the following reasons:-

  • You can set it to send individual PC and BS to each midi out when you change sequences.

  • Its a good midi master clock if you set the sequence looping even while it is playing nothing.

  • The 2 midi ins are merged and can be echoed to any midi out and channel. And the particular out and channle can be changed very easily on the front panel (change the current track).

Its not exactly full patching but a MPC is a pretty powerful center of a midi setup. Plus you get a free sampler and sequencer thrown in :slight_smile:

Cheers,
B

15

I love my M-Audio 8x8!

16

i have an old Akai ME80P, but for the life of me don’t know if it does what you want. Cool device in its day. i’ll see if i can dig out the scans of the manual i did.

17

I am in the same boat as the original poster as playing live I just haven’t found what I want and he described it perfectly. In fact after trying out some of the newer components on the mkt. I just gave up and bring a macbook along all the while hoping it doesn’t somehow fail. I will get back on my hardware search once again but I just want a basic no frills piece, don’t need it to do my laundry, wash my car or give the mates a massage all at the same time. Anyone use an Alesis MMT-8 from the early '90s maybe? when Genesis was in town a few years ago I talked with Tony and I think that is what he is still using after all these years.

18

Hey, sorry to resurrect an old thread, but im on the lookout for one of the above (Philip Rees 2M Midi merge unit)… anyone selling 1 or know anyone selling 1?

http://www.philrees.co.uk/products/pix/2mphoto.jpg

Thanks!
S

19

It’s tough to find an all in one as described by the OP. But the midimouse for program changes and the right combo of products from Midi-Solutions seems the best route from new equipment today.

As for the above post, check out http://www.midisolutions.com/products.htm

You would need 3 Thru boxes and a merger to accomplish the same task as the 2M though.

20

if your intention is to get a new instrument so that you can perform on stage or doing a gig, or whatsoever that you have in mind now, I would recommend you to get the things that you really need as the instruments that you are going to get is really depending on what you are going to use it for. If you are performing and looking to earn some respect, you should get one with great sound and good looking.