Keep my Waldorf Pulse, or is it redundant?

The Moog Forum Minimoog Forum
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I’ve been somewhat of a GAS victim since 2000 - what started as a hobbyist tiny set of keyboards became a criminally wasted set of retro hardware and an OTT mixer/computer rig that I could never use. Part of that setup was, initially, a Moog Rogue that was picked up for a trivial amount of money with only two weeks’ use on it (then stored for nearly 25 years).

When my friend passed away, I was asked to sort out his old studio, and bought a few items (at above eBay prices…) including a Waldorf Pulse+ (I also dismissed an offer of an EDP Wasp as a gift, which I’m both pleased about as it went for serious cash, but also annoyed about as when I recorded the sounds for the advert, it was like nothing else I’d heard!).

The Pulse+ proceeded to trash my speakers and clearly rendered the Rogue redundant.

However, I just got a Voyager; in fact part of the justification for not getting the Voyager ages ago (to stop myself glaring angrily at the prices) was that the Pulse could probably match it for my abilities. Now I’ve got one, I could sell my Pulse+ and either recoup some of the expense, or buy a Theremin (I’ve always wanted one).

Anyone got both (the Plus model adds CV and audio inputs) and have any comments? I’m not a sophisticated musician so playing both “at once” isn’t an option for me; if using both devices in a track for different sounds is possible then if the Moog can make the same sounds, there’s no point in having both.

Perspective: I have a SuperNova II. It made me not want the Dave Smith Prophet '08 or Evolver, since I figure the SuperNova can do much the same tricks - I’m hoping to get my MIDI setup to behave well enough to arp the Moog with the SuperNova.

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The sound of the Pulse (and the Pulse+ of cause too) and the Voyager is not identical. But they both sound very similar for newbies and typical music listeners. You get them to sound a like if you really try to do so. But if you listen really careful, there will be a difference in details like the envelope’s attack shape and the kind of filter saturation and distortion. And even the waveforms are not identical although they are named the same.
This is due to different technical approches.
On the plus side, the Pulse is never effected from pitch drift and detuning. It is rock solid on pitch from the moment you switch it on.
On the other hand the user interface sucks.
For example: set the cutoff frequency. Then adjust an envelope’s attack stage, go back to the filter and try to adjust a little bit. And suddenly the value jumps to the physical position of the envelope’s setting due to the multiple usage of normal pots. Endless Knobs would be way better for this 4 knob sound-design UI.

I have a Pulse here. And a Voyager. To me they are different enought to use both of them. But I use the Voyager more often by the factor of 10 or higher. If money and space is a matter, then sell the Pulse. But keep it, if you need additional analog voices for live or Midi-recording without multiple instrument tracks.

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Well, I did - eventually - make a decision - the MIDI aspect of my stuff was getting a bit hairy given the lack of useful tools, and the Pulse + was more susceptible to stuck notes than the rest of the gear. So when I spotted a V-Synth XT for a sensible price with “swaps considered”, I made an offer, but listed four of my instruments on eBay just in case they sold whilst his was still active - and I sold my Pulse+, Wavestation and D-550 in 24 hours and for the same amount as the V-Synth.

I do like the Pulse sounds, and I’m not really a newbie, but I’ve never really had time for programming properly. This is being rectified; the decision to sell the Pulse is partly because I will then have one accessible analogue synth - the Voyager - which I will learn how to program (and expand with some MFs).

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I think the V-Synth has a lot of potential. It has some good sounds for a digital synth. Im talking about the old Vsynth before they put 2 engines in 1 unit.

You have my frankensynth! You should be able to get some nice layers going with that, although the rack version lacks the Time Trip pad which I thought was its coolest feature.

Eric

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The XT has the time trip pad - it’s just doubled with the touchscreen, so you tap “Control” and get a graphic X-Y pad or a Time Trip pad. And of course since it’s an XT, I got a D-50-in-a-rack to replace the D-550/PG-1000 I sold, and a Vocoder that seems a touch easier to use than the one in the Wavestation A/D (or even the Supernova).

I want to use vocoders but I always find it a bit fiddly. There must be a “confident delivery of lines” that I just end up feeling silly doing, because I want to noodle AND mess with ideas.

Now I just need to sell the old house and buy an OASYS to replace the Trinity Pro X, and I think I’ll have no excuses at all for not getting back into this; I might find I don’t need it if I can just get the recording aspect right.

What is odd: I am fixing my friend’s Virus b, and I just don’t get the following for Virtual Analogues. I know why people like them, but why would anyone own more than one? I can’t work out what each does differently, but I have the urge to replace my Supernova with a Nord Lead 2x/3… and get told I should have a Virus…

Personally I’m leaning more towards an Andromeda; arps, and poly analogue.

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I’d take an Andromeda over VA any day. When I needed to sell some stuff I lost the Virus Ti and Little Phatty but kept the Andromeda and Voyager. I regret selling the Little Phatty but don’t miss the Virus at all. I can do everything it could do with a combination of the Andromeda and software (for the wavetable, granular and formant synthesis).

Now all I need to do is make time to actually use all this stuff.

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Well to me its purpose defeating technology.

They buy a digital synth, but they get the analogue modeling. :unamused:

Well the synths do sound good thats for sure. Pump it out at high volumes in a club setting and noone can really tell the difference.

Sometimes they can go beyond what Im into…when you hold down a key and they play these preprogrammed beats and pads and things that are supposed to sound great.

THe V-synth and the Fantom seem to play themselves sometimes, but I gotta have a Fanton G. Ill start looking at the 88 key Oaysis after I get me a Moog guitar lololol whicih won’t happen for awhile.

Id go for the ANdromeda as well, my cousin owned one and fr0om what I gather they seem to be on par with some of the better synths out there, Voyager, and the DSI Prophet.

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The thing with analogue modelling is that you get HUGE polyphony. Virus is what, 80 voices now? And you have all the envelopes you want; it’s all calculated. But there are so many variations; I know the formant source on the Virus is rather nice, but I like the Supernova’s sheer “OMGKNOBS” front panel and it has very good MIDI/sequencer features.

The Andromeda really came to my attention after Jen bought me the Voyager; in that I suddenly realised that the lovely mahogany case monosynth cost more than this beast of a 16-voice analogue polysynth. That was a bit of a shock. I tried a prophet and didn’t like it, however the dealer hadn’t set up the speakers properly and it was skipping voices.

There are so many variations on the theme. Waldorf Q? (Then I remember the original Waldorf Wave and this way, MORE OLD KIT lies and I’m trying to avoid doing that again). I suspect I will just upgrade my Supernova II to 48 voice, replace some worn pots, and stick with it (though the Q has CV. This is interesting).

As for the Oasys; I did more digging. The motherboard and CPU are so old hat now - and since it’s PC technology in a pretty case, I’m wanting PC progress for the amount that thing costs. Which means no 2.8GHz PIV; I want more RAM, dual-core (or for that money, /quad/ core) CPU, MUCH bigger hard disc (or at the very least, something really specialised like a 15,000 RPM, heavy duty one). Early models are now suffering failures of the motherboards that Korg cannot replace because they’re out of production - in theory a new PC motherboard and CPU should be easy to fit, but they optimised their OS for the hardware available.

And given that it does what it does on a single PIV, imagine what it could do with FOUR CPUs.

So Korg will get my money IF they update Oasys (and really IF they allow existing Oasys users an upgrade path - it doesn’t have to be cheap; if they move to quad cores, a new HD, etc - I’d expect that to be a £1,500 upgrade, just like buying a new PC) - if they let the 2005 purchasers lose that £5,600 investment with no support, then there’s no way I’m spending that kind of money on a synth.

Neuron suffered for much the same reasons (and being buggy as hell).

I suspect the logical upgrade from my Trinity Pro X is probably the M3-88 with EXB-R and Firewire. It’d probably do more than I ever need and for 1/2 the price of the Oasys. Makes me wonder if the M3 is a Linux/PC solution too…

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Only in Access’s marketing literature. Besides it’s “up to” 80 voices. You’d be very lucky to get a quarter of those 80 voices in practice. The complexity of a patch reduces polyphony. Adding things like unison, effects and analog saturation reduces polyphony even more.

That aside it is a beautiful sounding synth I just found it redundant in my setup.

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The reason the Prophet was skipping voices is because it’s a stereo instrument that doesn’t reduce it’s output to mono when you only plug one cable in. Even though the back is labelled L/Mono, it’s a typo! The Prophet is a great synth as well. I have a Prophet '08 which I love, a Voyager RME which is amazing, and had an Andromeda. Here are my thoughts on all three:

The Prophet is a great synth and a great value for the money. It’s not made as well as a Voyager, but it’s polyphonic. It has a great sequencer and usable arpeggiator. I wish the knobs were a bit less wobbly, and I wish I could punch in individual presets with a ten-key pad. It sounds killer though and I really love it.

The Voyager RME is AWESOME! I feel it has more soul and character than the Prophet, which is saying a LOT. Its one note is more versatile than the Prophet signal path. It’s made very, very well. I wish it had a way to access all of the presets more easily than the inc/dec buttons or using the External In amount knob. And I haven’t gotten the 3.x upgrade yet. Agan, a 10 key pad would be great. However, since it’s the rack, I would be more likely to use a synth with a keypad on it as a controller - like a Korg Z1, Triton, etc.

The Andromeda… I really loved it when I got it, but I found it to be buggy in the OS and incredibly unreliable. Eventually, mine became a $2500 paperweight that was difficult to fix. It seems to be pretty much the dreamsynth on paper that we would all want, but in the end, I prefer the sound and functionality of the Voyager and the Prophet. It could certainly do some incredibly lush and beautiful sounds though. I would say that it’s the most VA like of the three. I traded the A6 for the very cool V-Synth XT. Obviously different vibe, but a really cool piece nonetheless.

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The buggy bit was a fear I had with the Andromeda. It looked too good to be true. I know about the voice assignment, but I was already looking at the Moog when I was trying it, and you know which way that decision went!

I’m basically trying to decide if I should sell my Supernova II and get an Access Virus at this stage, since the Supernova sounds very “gritty” when handling a lot of voices. Like a blown speaker. The Virus can do gritty without that, and I know my speakers are okay. Either my Supernova is broken in some subtle way (and many things sound perfect on it), or they’re inferior to the Virus.

The big thing I miss from the synths I’ve owned is a simple, easy to use step sequencer like on the SH-101.

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Perhaps you are experiencing some internal overload. You could compensate for this by having each sound in a multi be a bit quieter, or if it’s a single voice, bring the volume back of the VCA amount, or reduce the volume of the individual oscillators on patches that require a lot of polyphony.

My Juno 106 does the same thing if I play a large chord and the VCA amount is too high. The Motif ES has a global output adjustment of either 0 or +6db depending on how you choose to use it.

The Viruses are awesome, but the Supernovas are great too, and less common nowadays which might be a plus.

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Keep everything, and never sell is my motto

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Mine too. I’ve bought all my gear with a reason.
If it becomes redundant I’ll use it in a new way so that it won’t be redundant anymore. :slight_smile:

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If gear is being redundant, you’re doing it wrong! Analog and Redundant should NEVER be used in the same sentence. :wink:

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You guys brought up a lot of interesting points about the Various synths. For me, in my current income bracket, the Voyager is about as top shelf as Im going to see for a few years.

WHen I turn into Herbie Hancock I can have myself an Oaysis and run it through a Bose speaker system.


I really don’t have anything against analogue modeling. My philosophy is that if it works, by all means use it. Thats one of the reasons why I have student model horns…because they still deliver that sound, and my playing nowhere near qualifies me to spend the money that it would cost for me to have pro upgrades.

Eric

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I believe there is a (beta) OS update for this that has a global stereo/mono switch. In fact, I know there is because I have it and I run my P08 in mono. I actually like it better that way.

DSI doesn’t seem to make their updates available on their web site but if you email them with a specific problem (which has happened to me 3 times between an MEK and a P08) they (many times) will send you an OS update to apply to resolve the problem.

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If I kept everything, I’d have:

Roland: S50, S550, MC202, TR505, EG-101, MC-303, JP8000, D110, GR300, G-505, GR700, G-707, GR77b, G-77b, SH-101, JD800, JV-50, Juno 6, SuperJX-10, D-50, D-550, DR-55, TD-3KV.

Korg M1 x 2, Wavestation, Wavestation A/D, Poly800 (reverse), Poly800 Mk II, Trinity Pro X + SOLO, MS2000, MS20, Poly61, T1, Prophecy, Polysix x2 (technically still got one, but it’s broken and promised to a friend), PME-40X modular effects pedal with a bunch of units.

Yamaha DX7, CX5M Mk II, CX5M, CX5M Mk II/128, YIS-805 MSX2 with SFG-05, FB01, TX816, QX1, SHS-10, MR-10.

GEM Equinox 88.

Jen SX2000.

Casio CZ-101, CZ-1000, DG10, DG20, VZ-10M.

Akai S1000 32Mb, S900, AX73.

Moog Rogue.

Waldorf Pulse+.

Sequential Circuits Drumtraks.

Carlsbro and MXR pedals.

Atari ST, STE, Falcons.

Apple iMac 600, PowerMac G4, PowerMac G5.

Acorn/BBC Hybrid Music System (8/16 voice digital synthesizer, very sophisticated for 1984).

Apple II-based AlphaSyntauri - much like above but 1979, Wavetable based, P&R keyboard like an old Moog.

Zoom 707MkII and RT123.

Hora C110 Student Cello.

Spirit M8, Allen & Heath GS1,Mackie 1202 VLZ, Behringer MX8000A.

Various guitars and things.

What I have now:

Roland V-Synth XT
Moog Voyager + VX
Access Virus Indigo 2 (replaces…)
Novation Supernova II (for sale)
Korg Trinity Pro X V3
Jen SX1000
Akai CD3000XL (unused now)
Mackie Onyx Satellite + Dell XPS M2010 or Macbook Pro
Yamaha 20-channel mixer
Some outboard stuff, couple of guitars, electric cello & violin.

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You would have a nice big studio! :smiley:

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THat list was severely lacking Moogs lolol

just teasing man.

My first keyboard was a Casio SK1 or an SK 5…whichever had the pads and the sampler. My sister had the other one, whichever wasn’t the one I had. lol

My father woke me up playing with it after Santa delivered it the same year I got the Indiana Jones and the temple of Doom computer game (if you can guess which yuear that was)

Eric