Issues for some other day

mikeh11 · February 29, 2016, 2:08pm

0.9.44 and 1.1.24 are looking very good, from my perpective.
Here’s some rough-edge issues that might need attention some other day, some other release.
Many of these are old, some were raised by others, none are earth shattering.

The Sequence Mod Destination list has these entries:
ARP Pattern
LFO1 Phase
LFO1 DutyCycle
LFO2 Phase
LFO2 DutyCycle
which do not exist, as far as I can tell.
The Sub 37 manual discusses a sequence pattern rotation. The editor has no notion of that.
The keyboard tracking knobs for the modulators show their values as percentages. Double click to enter a number. The value popup shows a percentage. But entering a percentage, to match the prompt, is wrong. The input is really a big-num - you need to enter 8192 to get 100%. (which I understand - I just don’t like the popup telling me to enter a percent.)
The CV Mapping destinations include LFO Rates, but they’re missing from the other mod destinations - MOD1 MOD2 and seq mod dest.
Hover over the Setup button; get “Click to open the preferences window.”
Hover over SW/FW versions on the Setup page, and get nice popups.

would be nice if the strings could be copied
for example, one combined SW/FW string for paste into bug reports
or an Info button to popup a panel with info to copy: sw/fw/os/date …

Inconsistent mouse-pointer for MOD Hi Range

the rule seems to be “on/off” is a pointing finger, otherwise an arrow for multiple choice.
the MODs Hi Range gets an arrow, while Sync and KB reset get the fickle finger of fate. (left-over from lo-med-hi range?)

Cross panel drags:

drag LFO1 KB Track from 0 to 165%, or drag LFO2 KB Track from 0 to 80%
the value popup jumps to another knob, interrupting KB track adjustment.
only happens when the drag crosses the upper/lower panel boundary.

We can confuse the librarian and give the middle column a reddish tint:

select a preset, drag it to the User folder, then well below it, and drop.
get a reddish tint in the middle column.
(because of the unfinished drag and drop)
clear the tint by dragging a preset slightly out of position.
the tint does not occur if the drag path is down past the folders and then to the left.
It knows not to let us put presets directly into the Preset Library directory.

We can put presets directly into the Presets Library directory:

click in the blank area below the User folder, to deselect all folders.
drag a preset over from the Hardware List.
drop it onto the blank area below the User folder.
or drag and drop a preset from the OS.
the presets get placed into the Presets Library directory.

The Librarian doesn’t remember the last used directory:

select a folder, double click on a preset to edit it.
go to another page, then come back.
no indication of which folder we’re using, although we see the contents of it.

Librarian sorting: when sorting by category, it should sort by names within the category.
Librarian: Should the search field be per-folder?

select Factory Presets.
enter “acr” in the search field.
copy Across the Sky.
go to a test folder (with some other presets already in it), and paste.
see only Across the Sky, because the search field is still set.

Librarian: ‘Save as’ doesn’t take the hint of the current selected folder:

select a folder
init preset
save as
get the upper level directory, “Presets Library”
would have preferred that it chose the current folder.
(well, sometimes it does)

Librarian: sub-folders can be hidden:

select Trash Audio
press return key; the sub-dirs got folded up
go to other preset folders
come back
looks just like an empty folder
perhaps an icon change to represent folded up folders - a folder outline with plus-sign in it

The icon.

GilW · February 29, 2016, 7:41pm

Thanks Mike ! Loads of important information here.

I will process it all into bug reports.

LuLoop · February 29, 2016, 11:52pm

Wow mike…This is a fine list.
I have some more…but I wait after the release…
You put a lot of energy in this project.
Respect..

Wish you all the best…And warm regards from Luloop.

GilW · March 2, 2016, 5:51pm

Fixed to 0.9.47.

mikeh11 · March 4, 2016, 12:32am

And verified! Good work!
Although I’m sorry to see the mod destinations go.

0.9.47 is ready!

GilW · March 4, 2016, 12:46am

Well, not really. We are still testing it thoroughly here. There will be another version soon.

mikeh11 · March 26, 2016, 11:52am

Directory name: in the Sub 37 directory “Hardware bank” → “Hardware Bank”; consistent caps.

Preset Browser: sort the category names in the drop-down menu alphabetically, not by the internal numeric values.

Preset Browser: the name is 2x12 characters, but the display area is 2x16 or so. Extra space; looks “off”. Maybe it’s a canned GUI element and can’t be changed.

Preset Browser: the font has no lower-case? Wha?!

Surachai/Eb DRONE → EB DRONE

Preset Browser: the font is a little goofy.

tildes in the top line are chopped off at the top
see Surachai/ALIVE~~~~
the ampersand is … “different”, like a cross between an O and a G
(I have a hard time recognizing it. Must be old eyes. S&H comes out like SOH)
see Richard Devine/Hold & Roll and three Salmagundi’s S&H’s

Preset Browser / Save as…

would be nice to pick up the currently selected folder from the Librarian
I usually pick a folder to work in, then save-as (since I learned not to trust save)
but the file chooser puts me a level up.

Preset Browser / Save as…

when saving an Init Preset, didn’t it use to name the preset the same as the file-system name? That was useful.

Librarian: presets are still shown after deleting a folder.

select a folder
select a preset within the folder
delete the folder
The preset list remains; can manipulate the presets (rename, copy), but get errors.

Librarian, deleting a folder: get “Are you sure ?”, extra space, looks funny

Librarian, preset folders: would be nice to have indication of sub-folders.
The return key opens/closes the folder, but when closed, it looks exactly like an empty folder.

select Trash Audio
press return key, it folds up
select another folder, come back, it looks empty.

Librarian: regenerates deleted files

select a preset in a folder with several presets
do a ‘Reveal’ and delete one preset file from the OS
try to rename that preset in the Librarian
the Librarian re-creates the preset

Librarian: unusual sort order of Presets

make three presets: init init2 init3
they’re ordered nicely
rename init2 to init22
new order: init init3 init22

Request: some kind of drag and drop to copy presets between folders

instead of moving
use shift/opt/alt/command/control/whatever

Request: option to not swap Hardware Presets presets when dragging

rather drag and overwrite
or drag and insert (!) to re-order

Request: ability to mark some banks read-only

even if only a few of them, the first 1, 2, or 4?
might be nice for the hardware, too?

Request: root note parameter for tunings

a CC control or lowest MIDI octave (C-1 to B-1)
allows key modulation (sort-of) on the fly
without having to use menu to pick a new scale
the octave tuning is the same, just applied to a different root
Kurzweil has had this for awhile - separation of intonation and scale root

Request: uncouple the preset name and its file name

the file name is not the preset name
and the preset name is not rewritten as the sanitized file name
might have carefully sculpted preset name:

		 / O M G \      \/ \  / I       /\__
		/ M O O G \     /\  \/  I      /    \

but changing it to the file-system name ruins that effort

Request: Editor: add a couple of generic buttons to send CC switch messages

useful for the standalone app
for additional controls such as RELEASE ON
since there’s no such button on the hardware

Request: one-shot mode for arp/seq

arp: hit a cluster of notes and it arps them once
seq: hit a base-note and it plays the sequence once
OK if it requires latch on

Request: mod destinations for sequencer first/last notes

or first-note and note-span
for evolving seq patterns
application: harmonic series, play a changing segment of it

Request: LFO 1/2 rate in mod destination lists everywhere

want to self-modulate wave to get different mod shape
i.e. warp the triangle wave

Request: sysex specification?

mikeh11 · April 13, 2016, 8:01pm

OK, another request:

maybe have the ability to use the mod-values in the sequence steps as values in a 64 position look-up table. Use some mod-source as input, it gets quantized to 64 steps, and that mod-value is the output. A general black-box function. Linear interpolation between steps is optional.

GilW · April 13, 2016, 11:12pm

Hey Mike,

Thanks (again) for your very detailed list of issues and feature requests. Btw, the forum won’t be closed… We are heading a new beta soon so get ready to some more action

I will check your report and process it asap.

Gil.

bernard · April 14, 2016, 6:08am

Can you please explain what is the (your) purpose of such a table?
I think, if the user could define such a table (or better such tables) by himself, it would make sense, i.e. to define special curves. But a simple quantization to the half of steps I don’t understand.

Linear interpolation however would require a lag module which I would really like to see behind the random wave of the LFOs.

cheers,
Bernard

mikeh11 · April 14, 2016, 6:45pm

Hi, Bernard!

I’m not talking about the notes of the sequence, but rather the modulation values that are stored at each position within the sequence. Assuming that the preset is not using the sequence to play notes, those values are sitting there “unused”. I just thought that they could be used as a 64-point look-up table, for modulation shaping (bowed curve, or S-curve) or quantizing (3, 5, N-step LFO waveshapes) or whatever. I wouldn’t think a lag module would be needed in this case - interpolation might be needed if the input and output sources required more precision than the bipolar 8 bits of the sequence mod-values, or if we wanted a smoother response than we can get with 64 points.

It’s just a dream, anyway!

bernard · April 15, 2016, 6:25am

Hey Mikeh,

thanks. Let me see …
You want use the 64 (or less) steps of the sequence as a “free running” modulation source. Funny idea, indeed.
So the user could “draw” a waveform when running these steps periodically (where the speed is determined by LFO 1 or 2 speed, or arp rate), or use it as a one shot triggered envelope (triggered by gate). That would be great.
And you’re right, interpolation is necessary if you want to get a smooth run.

Hope to see it in future!

cheers,
Bernard

mikeh11 · April 15, 2016, 12:17pm

We can get a free-running stepped LFO now, by using the Seq Mod Only switch to “play” the mod-values from the sequence. I guess my idea was to use another modulation source to index the sequence steps, instead of stepping through the values linearly.

Also, a second look-up table could be made from the velocity values stored in the sequence. Unipolar only, I suppose. Ditto for the note values? Three warping tables? Niiice!

GilW · April 16, 2016, 1:21am

Directory name: in the Sub 37 directory “Hardware bank” → “Hardware Bank”; consistent caps.
Trivial, reported.

Preset Browser: sort the category names in the drop-down menu alphabetically, not by the internal numeric values.
This is one of the features that need rethinking and maybe changing accordingly.

Preset Browser: the name is 2x12 characters, but the display area is 2x16 or so. Extra space; looks “off”. Maybe it’s a canned GUI element and can’t be changed.
Looks right to me, I think it’s a matter of GUI design.

Preset Browser: the font has no lower-case? Wha?!

Surachai/Eb DRONE → EB DRONE
Again, a matter of GUI design. I think it’s a matter of taste basically but it has been discussed before and has been decided to keep it all capital.

Preset Browser: the font is a little goofy.

tildes in the top line are chopped off at the top
see Surachai/ALIVE~~~~
the ampersand is … “different”, like a cross between an O and a G
(I have a hard time recognizing it. Must be old eyes. S&H comes out like SOH)
see Richard Devine/Hold & Roll and three Salmagundi’s S&H’s
The font type has been also discussed, and it’s been decided to keep it.

Preset Browser / Save as…

would be nice to pick up the currently selected folder from the Librarian
I usually pick a folder to work in, then save-as (since I learned not to trust save)
but the file chooser puts me a level up.
Now it should take you to the last folder you used for this function.

Preset Browser / Save as…

when saving an Init Preset, didn’t it use to name the preset the same as the file-system name? That was useful.
The preset is saved using the new/edited name. So if it’s set to INIT PRESET, and you didn’t change it, that will be it’s new name.
I agree it can be confusing as long as the preset name in the library is not changed to INIT PRESET as well. I’m not sure what should really happen but we’ll give it another check.

Librarian: presets are still shown after deleting a folder.

select a folder
select a preset within the folder
delete the folder
The preset list remains; can manipulate the presets (rename, copy), but get errors.
reproduced and reported

Librarian, deleting a folder: get “Are you sure ?”, extra space, looks funny
This is the way we set all messages so no need to comment for every message as it’s by design. For now I think we feel comfortable with it

Librarian, preset folders: would be nice to have indication of sub-folders.
The return key opens/closes the folder, but when closed, it looks exactly like an empty folder.

select Trash Audio
press return key, it folds up
select another folder, come back, it looks empty.
known, another feature which can be nice to add in future versions.

Librarian: regenerates deleted files

select a preset in a folder with several presets
do a ‘Reveal’ and delete one preset file from the OS
try to rename that preset in the Librarian
the Librarian re-creates the preset
This is a feature actually. In Windows the default library folders are recreated if deleted, as there’s no installer.
In Mac the installer is supposed recreate them, but it wasn’t handled yet so the workaround at this point is to manually delete Presets Library/Moog Music folder. Or, were you referring to a different issue ?

Librarian: unusual sort order of Presets

make three presets: init init2 init3
they’re ordered nicely
rename init2 to init22
new order: init init3 init22
Again, sorting issues are planned to be targeted on a future version.

Request: some kind of drag and drop to copy presets between folders

instead of moving
use shift/opt/alt/command/control/whatever
Has been suggested before as feature request, thanks.

Request: option to not swap Hardware Presets presets when dragging

rather drag and overwrite
or drag and insert (!) to re-order
This can

Request: ability to mark some banks read-only

even if only a few of them, the first 1, 2, or 4?
might be nice for the hardware, too?

Request: root note parameter for tunings

a CC control or lowest MIDI octave (C-1 to B-1)
allows key modulation (sort-of) on the fly
without having to use menu to pick a new scale
the octave tuning is the same, just applied to a different root
Kurzweil has had this for awhile - separation of intonation and scale root

Request: uncouple the preset name and its file name

the file name is not the preset name
and the preset name is not rewritten as the sanitized file name
might have carefully sculpted preset name:

		 / O M G \      \/ \  / I       /\__
		/ M O O G \     /\  \/  I      /    \

but changing it to the file-system name ruins that effort

Request: Editor: add a couple of generic buttons to send CC switch messages

useful for the standalone app
for additional controls such as RELEASE ON
since there’s no such button on the hardware

Request: one-shot mode for arp/seq

arp: hit a cluster of notes and it arps them once
seq: hit a base-note and it plays the sequence once
OK if it requires latch on

Request: mod destinations for sequencer first/last notes

or first-note and note-span
for evolving seq patterns
application: harmonic series, play a changing segment of it

Request: LFO 1/2 rate in mod destination lists everywhere

want to self-modulate wave to get different mod shape
i.e. warp the triangle wave

Request: sysex specification?

I will post all requests for inspection, not sure all of them can are need to be added, thanks for suggesting.

mikeh11 · April 16, 2016, 1:02pm

Hi, Gil!
Here’s a snapshot of what I mean with the 2x12 names in a 2x16 display.
Both lines have 12 characters, but there’s a 4 character gap on the right side. I guess Juce has only a 2x16 display element, eh?
Wide Preset Name.png
(Also, tildes get chopped off on the first line.)

Librarian: regenerates deleted files

select a preset in a folder with several presets

do a ‘Reveal’ and delete one preset file from the OS

try to rename that preset in the Librarian

the Librarian re-creates the preset
… In Mac the installer is supposed recreate them, but it wasn’t handled yet so the workaround at this point is to manually delete Presets Library/Moog Music folder. Or, were you referring to a different issue ?

Yep, different issue. Long after installation, when the Editor is running. Pick a folder, delete a preset from the OS, the editor will put that preset back.

GilW · April 19, 2016, 11:37pm

Tilde char appears correctly here on top display if the first character in the preset name
The 12 vs 16 chars issue is all by design
I’m still not totally understand your deleted preset scenario and result, please elaborate by providing clear steps

Thanks !

mikeh11 · April 20, 2016, 8:09pm

Here’s what I see for tildes on the top line:

GilW · April 20, 2016, 9:31pm

Now I see what you mean. And it shows up in OSX only.

Reported, thanks !

mikeh11 · April 20, 2016, 11:24pm

I’m still not totally understand your deleted preset scenario and result, please elaborate by providing clear steps

Gil, thank you for your tenacity with this item! It’s not a big issue, just a quirk.

Preset Resurrection

In the Librarian…

make a scratch folder, add a few presets to it
select a preset
bring up the menu for it, select “Reveal in Finder” (or whatever)
from the Finder, delete the preset
back to the Librarian, bring up the menu for that just-deleted preset
select Rename, and rename the preset
look in the Finder window and see that the preset is back
Whaa?

That’s unexpected. I thought I would get an error that we couldn’t rename a file that didn’t exist. Just a curious thing. It surprised me when it first happened.

The Librarian handles other misdeeds reasonably:

the Librarian can handle a file getting deleted behind its back

delete a preset using the process above
switch to a different folder, then come back
the preset is gone
Good.

the Librarian can tell when the file is deleted

delete a preset like the above
select “Reveal” for that just-deleted preset
the Finder window shows the folder, without selecting a preset
Good.

Super low priority, if it even makes the list.

GilW · April 21, 2016, 12:56am

Not really.

You׳re tricking the Editor by deleting the actual preset file and not the preset from within the Editor.

The correct, and natural way to do that is either click the preset and delete it from the Editor,
or if you organize your preset files, then upon loading the Editor it should only show the existing presets.

If both work as expected, then it’s not a real “bug”. Just a non-handled, unusual end-case.