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FreqBox MF-107 crackles (clip insdide)

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FreqBox MF-107 crackles (clip insdide)

Postby nectarios » Mon Mar 26, 2012 2:08 pm

Hi there, I have recently acquired a bunch of Moog stuff.
Image
Everything is fine except the MF-107. It crackles so much it basically renders a broad spectrum of what I want to do, impossible.
Here's a clip:
http://soundcloud.com/nectesting/freqboxcrackles
Is this normal? I really like how it sounds, even if its hard to tune and all.
In any case, if that amount of crackling supposed to be there, I am going to send it back and get a MF-102 Ring Mod.

Regards,
Nectarios.
x0xb0x, Moog Slim Phatty, Moog Minitaur, MF-102, MF-103, MF-108, CP-251, Access Virus C, Nord Lead 1, NI Maschine, ProCo RAT2, Big Muff π Bass, Logic Pro 9.
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Re: FreqBox MF-107 crackles (clip insdide)

Postby jeepo » Tue Mar 27, 2012 12:11 am

does it crackle with sync turned off? One thing i've thought of that can cause crackling is hiting the fooger hard enough that it clips really hard. Try turning down the gain the see if the crackle goes away.
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Re: FreqBox MF-107 crackles (clip insdide)

Postby shortsleeves » Tue Mar 27, 2012 5:18 am

Have you tried with Drive turned down? Have you tried another powersupply? I found FB is quite picky about where its power's coming from.

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Re: FreqBox MF-107 crackles (clip insdide)

Postby nectarios » Tue Mar 27, 2012 6:11 am

Hello,
I have tried all sorts of input levels, made sure the level led only flashes green, tried a higher input to see if the extra harshness "masks" the crackles, but it crackles every time, even when the sync is off.
I am using the Moog power supply that came with it...I'll switch over and use the MF-108's power supply to see if that fixes things at all.
Hope this works as I really like the MF-107...being able to get VCO sync acid lines and sweep the VCO frequency manually is something I've always wanted to do + it sounds great with the Slim Phatty as well.

Will report back in a few hours.

Regards,
Nectarios.
x0xb0x, Moog Slim Phatty, Moog Minitaur, MF-102, MF-103, MF-108, CP-251, Access Virus C, Nord Lead 1, NI Maschine, ProCo RAT2, Big Muff π Bass, Logic Pro 9.
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Re: FreqBox MF-107 crackles (clip insdide)

Postby shortsleeves » Tue Mar 27, 2012 6:29 am

nectarios wrote:I am using the Moog power supply that came with it...I'll switch over and use the MF-108's power supply to see if that fixes things at all


Try another wall socket/powerstripe when you're at it – just to make sure. But from what you wrote it sounds you got a lemon :-(

Cheers,
Lukasz
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Re: FreqBox MF-107 crackles (clip insdide)

Postby Rabalder » Tue Mar 27, 2012 9:41 am

I had the exact same problem a few months ago.
My setup is powered by one single outlet. All foogers powered by moog adapters(230Volts).

I ended up trying four different freqboxes, all of them placed in the exact same spot in my signal chain.
The crackles was only present on the models with a high serial number.
Below 1000, and the problem was gone.

Dont ask me why.. Could just be a coincident... :?
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Re: FreqBox MF-107 crackles (clip insdide)

Postby nectarios » Tue Mar 27, 2012 1:09 pm

Tried different adapters, different wall sockets, and no luck, it still crackles.
SN. is 3480...so what do I do now then? How do I find a unit that has a serial number below 1000?
x0xb0x, Moog Slim Phatty, Moog Minitaur, MF-102, MF-103, MF-108, CP-251, Access Virus C, Nord Lead 1, NI Maschine, ProCo RAT2, Big Muff π Bass, Logic Pro 9.
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Re: FreqBox MF-107 crackles (clip insdide)

Postby Pantherairsoft » Wed Mar 28, 2012 7:09 pm

I apologise if I'm missing something, but I hear no 'crackle' in that demo. I hear the distorted sounds of my freqbox. To me, that demo sounds exactly how the pedal is supposed to sound in my experience... or am I missing something?
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Re: FreqBox MF-107 crackles (clip insdide)

Postby nectarios » Wed Mar 28, 2012 8:49 pm

Its between the notes mate, you can easily hear it.
I got a reply from Moog tech support saying this is normal MF-107 behaviour, which is disappointing to say the least, as my cheap Doepfer modular VCOs do not exhibit this sort of behaviour, far from it actually...I understand and I am wiling to pay more for a Moog product because of the quality of sound...but this, I still can't believe this pedal was design to sound this way...will trade it for an MF-102...shame cause crackles aside, the timbre of the MF-107 is quite rich and interesting, but the crackles render it useless for the studio.
Why oh why wasn't this problem addressed is beyond me...and its weird as already mentioned, it does not happen with all MF-107s.
:(

Regards,
Nectarios.
x0xb0x, Moog Slim Phatty, Moog Minitaur, MF-102, MF-103, MF-108, CP-251, Access Virus C, Nord Lead 1, NI Maschine, ProCo RAT2, Big Muff π Bass, Logic Pro 9.
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Re: FreqBox MF-107 crackles (clip insdide)

Postby EMwhite » Wed Mar 28, 2012 9:29 pm

I listened to the clip and it either is not pronounced enough to hear or it's exactly as I would expect.

The Freqbox should possibly be renamed 'racket'-box; if fed the "wrong" signal, it is going to sound like random crap (a technical term).

But all kidding aside, you need the perfect combination of a strong enough signal, and a large degree of clean harmonics in order to produce something that might seem pleasing to the ear. On the other hand, it can be used to create havoc, if that is the intent.

I've found that a good mix of "MIX" on the FreqBox and a filter or Murf to follow cleans it up to a nice distortion.

As an OSCillator, it works really really good but that's feeding it a control voltage in the FREQ input so that's a somewhat different function. I've heard demos where folks have fed clean sine wave into the audio input and the result is very predictable, controllable, and pleasing.

I'm a bass player by trade and I can tell you that it's major havoc. I prefer a fuzz (the TC Electronic MojoMojo pedal) to the outright distortion that the FreqBox provides but it has a nice envelope follower and the OSC function that I mentioned above so I'm keeping it for now.

You might find that a compressor in FRONT of the Freqbox and a filter after is just what you needed and will give you the crunch that you might be after.

EDIT: I just tried something out using my Little Phatty and it's 'calibration' preset into the Audio in and something struck me. It's to give you the following advise. Rather than trying to clean up and deal with a tone that you don't like, start with something simple and figure out what it is that makes the FreqBox behave the way it does. From there, you'll be able to much more easily deal tailor the resulting output.

I'm also reminded of something that either Bob Moog said or Cyril Lance or Steve Dunnington or Brian Kehew said (I know, that's a bunch of different people) but it went something like this "we like to give the musician as many knobs and controls as possible with as much range as possible so that there are no limits to the music that can be made". That's not a direct quote, I just put it in quotes to give you the rough idea of what was said, but my point is that the FreqBox has many many combinations of signal and settings that result in dropouts and crackle as you said. I suppose they could have give you a much smaller range of sweep on the pots but it wouldn't have been the same.

I hope you get it working to your liking. I've seen a number of rough demos on YouTube and very few good ones. I think it comes to patience and persistence.
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Re: FreqBox MF-107 crackles (clip insdide)

Postby nectarios » Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:54 am

Well, in the 12 years that I have been programming analog synths, no linear FM VCO crackles so much. The OSC OUT is clean, but the AUDIO OUT crackles even with the mix all the way down...I'll send it back to Thomann and ask if they can do a proper quality control on the next unit they will send me. If that one crackles like this, I'll replace the FreqBox with the Ring Mod and see what else is there on the market for analog FM, cause this is unacceptable.

Regards,
Nectarios.
x0xb0x, Moog Slim Phatty, Moog Minitaur, MF-102, MF-103, MF-108, CP-251, Access Virus C, Nord Lead 1, NI Maschine, ProCo RAT2, Big Muff π Bass, Logic Pro 9.
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Re: FreqBox MF-107 crackles (clip insdide)

Postby EMwhite » Thu Mar 29, 2012 8:45 am

Apologies, I must have missed the part where the mix all the way anti-clockwise resulted in crackling. Yup, something wrong, sorry about that.
Moog Voyager Select, Taurus 3, Opus 3; Oberheim Son of 2-voice; Sequential ProOne; Waldorf Blofeld; 48 of MU Modular; Kurzweil 250; Hammond M3; Fender '75 Jazz, Tony Franklin Fretless, Hoppus, Roadworn Jazz; Yamaha Att III; Mesa Amps; MF101,102,104M,105M
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Re: FreqBox MF-107 crackles (clip insdide)

Postby nectarios » Fri Mar 30, 2012 2:04 pm

I've sent the MF-107 back to Thomann where I bought it from to be replaced.
I asked if it is possible for one of the people over there to do a quality control to avoid going through many MF-107s and going down the post office to send them back, until I find a working one (as mentioned in this thread) and if that cannot be done, I asked for it to be replaced by an MF-102 Ring Mod, a Proco Rat2 and the gool ol' BOSS OS2 for them classic distorted acid lines.

Regards,
Nectarios.
x0xb0x, Moog Slim Phatty, Moog Minitaur, MF-102, MF-103, MF-108, CP-251, Access Virus C, Nord Lead 1, NI Maschine, ProCo RAT2, Big Muff π Bass, Logic Pro 9.
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Re: FreqBox MF-107 crackles (clip insdide)

Postby jeepo » Fri Mar 30, 2012 2:36 pm

You have proposed replacing the 107 with a 102. I personally think you would love the distortion effects that come from using both of the together. The 107 makes a great carrier for the 102, resulting in great hardsync octave fuzz. As you may or may not know, foogers are better in groups because they get lonely. Just kidding (maybe). They are better in groups because sonic possibilities increase exponentially with each additional fooger, that said, in your situation I would have bought the 102 first and then later the 107 (actually that is exactly the order my fooger aquisition went down). If I choose the 107 as my first fooger, I would follow it with either a 101 or a 105m (unless I already had filters), as sometimes the freqbox is a beast that needs to be tamed. Filters tame the beast. I got a little off topic there, but I hope it helps somebody.
Stage II, MF-102, MF-105m, MF-107, paia theremin, akai s2000, yamaha pss 680, yamaha cp 25, and other stuff
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Re: FreqBox MF-107 crackles (clip insdide)

Postby nectarios » Sat Mar 31, 2012 8:20 am

The first moogerfooger I bought was the MF-108M cause there was a limited number of them and I definitely wanted one in the studio.
Then I wanted to be able to make Frequency Modulation patches, hence I went down the FM-107 way. Ideally I wanted to be able to send CV to the MF-107 through a Kenton MIDI to CV converter, to be able to get controlled FM for more than just that one tuned FM-107 note.
But I was stopped on my tracks by the crackling made from the unit I got...Thomann said it is impossible for them to do a quality control over the next unit they can send me and I got an email from Moog Tech Support as well saying that although they can the guy who has been testing every pedal for the last 12 years came and heard the clip I sent and that there is indeed a crackling noise in the background, they went on reiterating that the FreqBox is a strange instrument capable of some very odd behavior and that I should test mine next to another FreqBox at a dealer somewhere...only thing is that the Moog dealer in Athens Greece, only has the MF-101 at the shop...

Anyhow, Thomann is going to issue a refund for me, and I will proceed with getting the MF-102 and wait until the Moog Athens dealer brings an MF-107 in the shop that I can test and maybe pick up.

Regards,
Nectarios.
x0xb0x, Moog Slim Phatty, Moog Minitaur, MF-102, MF-103, MF-108, CP-251, Access Virus C, Nord Lead 1, NI Maschine, ProCo RAT2, Big Muff π Bass, Logic Pro 9.
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