Patch cables, TRS?

Chromatic · Post by **Chromatic** » Fri Jan 06, 2006 10:38 am

Ok, I have a Voyager, a VX-CV expander and the cp-251 controll processor. I had a look at the manual for the CP-251 and now I am not sure of what type of patch cables to make. It mentions using TRS jacks but with the ring dissconected. Is this the best way to move on this? Also can anyone give me an idea of the combinations of length I may need. Both units are on the table to the left of my Moog. As some signals will be audio I guess that OFC is a good idea.

Duke Foog · Post by **Duke Foog** » Fri Jan 06, 2006 2:04 pm

my understanding is that you have to use either exclusively balanced or unbalanced. i don't think you can mix the 2. i think their expression pedals are balanced so if you use one you will have to use all balanced cables.

GregAE · Post by **GregAE** » Fri Jan 06, 2006 2:37 pm

Duke Foog wrote:my understanding is that you have to use either exclusively balanced or unbalanced. i don't think you can mix the 2. i think their expression pedals are balanced so if you use one you will have to use all balanced cables.

Hi Duke!

Actually you can mix & match TRS and regular 1/4' patch cords with 'Foogers - they work fine. Note, however, if you plug a regular cord into a jack that provides power to an expression pedal, none of the powered jacks can be used for expression pedals because you've shorted the power to all. The short poses no problem to either the Moogerfooger or the device plugged in and causes no harm.

If you don't feel comfortable dealing with this, you can use all-TRS types for every connection. They will work just fine for every jack. The only downside is that you may find ready-made TRS cables harder to come by and possibly more expensive then the regular types. If you make them yourself, though, this is not an issue.

Greg

Duke Foog · Post by **Duke Foog** » Fri Jan 06, 2006 3:13 pm

oh.. that makes more sense now. i reread that paragraph in the fooger manuals about 20 times and couldn't make sense of it.

thanks man

monads · Post by **monads** » Mon Jan 09, 2006 12:28 pm

Duke Foog wrote:oh.. that makes more sense now. i reread that paragraph in the fooger manuals about 20 times and couldn't make sense of it.

thanks man

You're not alone

I just use the following http://www.zzounds.com/item--CBIGA

Not the best but I haven't had a chance to replace them.

Lengai · Post by **Lengai** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 9:41 pm

Chromatic,

For CV cables, you can use the el cheapos which frees up more money for quality audio cables. If you go to: http://www.sweetwatersound.com and type in "CPP" in the search box, you'll see all of the Hosa CV cables and they are very inexpensive. They come in 8-packs so you can get different lengths. Sweetwater's ProCo audio cables are pretty good quality and are affordable too.

I had major confusion about the MF manuals too. The whole thing centers on the EP-1. As others stated, if you are not using an EP-1 then use whatever you want. the problem comes in if you use an EP-1 with either the CP-251 or a MF. The only way to use a MF by itself with the EP-1 and CV cables or the red jacks on the CP-251 with an EP-1 and CV cables to other red jack(s) is to use TRS cables. You have to modify the TRS cables by snipping the ring connector wire inside the cable (use the cables with metal screw tips). I got that from Moog.

GregAE · Post by **GregAE** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 8:50 am

Folks,

As a point of clarification, shorting a red jack in the CP-251 using a standard 1/4" plug does not short power to all other red jacks. The shorting behavior only occurs in the Moogerfooger pedals. The confusion here could be because the CP-251 is labeled as a Moogerfooger.

Lengai -

Ditto on the Hosa cables. I use 'em too - they work well and they are inexpensive. They seem to be readily available at most music stores, and come in a variety of colors in standard and TRS plug configurations. Since the cables are molded, however, you can't modify the TRS plugs. This means that you may still end up making a few custom TRS cables for use with the MF pedal/Expression Pedal combo.

A final thought about cables: they go bad over time. I'd suggest the purchase of a cable tester, which will will quickly allow you to check a suspect cable. I picked up one at my local music store for $15. Checks standard and TRS 1/4", RCA plug and XLR cable tyoes. It's a handy tool to have in your gig bag or studio.

Greg

peter ripa · Post by **peter ripa** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 10:31 am

cables can be very annoying. every now and then i have to kill one to keep the others in line

Chromatic · Post by **Chromatic** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 5:09 am

Thank you so much for this. I am sure the wording in the manual could be more concise. It's not difficult to understand the concept and would just take about 2-3 lines instead of about forty.

I am too mean to buy ready made cables so back to the iron it is. My solder scabs were just starting to heal too! Ahhhhh the smell of bacon and hair.

Thanks again

C

theglyph · Post by **theglyph** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 12:33 pm

Chromatic,

What type/brand of cable and connectors do you buy and where would be the best place to purchase said materials?

asd · Post by **asd** » Sun Jan 15, 2006 6:04 pm

so is it bad to use trs cables without snipping the ring connector? can doing this mess something up?

i definitely thought that this portion of the mf manuals could have been written a lot better. i'm not a real mechanical person so maybe that's why, but it was really unclear for me.

GregAE · Post by **GregAE** » Sun Jan 15, 2006 6:24 pm

asd wrote:so is it bad to use trs cables without snipping the ring connector? can doing this mess something up?

You can safely use TRS cables w/o snipping the ring connector - it will not mess anything up. Since the ring connection is where an Expression Pedal gets power (power flows out from the ring, through the pedal, and returns to the tip), snipping the ring connection in a TRS cable prevents the power from being shorted out. As stated before, if the power is shorted for just one CV input (using a standard 1/4" plug), then the power is shorted for all CV jacks, and an expression pedal won't get any power, rendering the pedal useless. By snipping the ring connection from a TRS plug, you prevent the 'short' and make it possible to use an expression pedal(s) with other CV connections.

Greg

Chromatic · Post by **Chromatic** » Tue Jan 17, 2006 9:01 am

Quote "What type/brand of cable and connectors do you buy and where would be the best place to purchase said materials?"

I use Van Dam OFC and Neutriks torpedo style connectors. I get my stuff in London Locally. OK it is expencive. Even more than ready made moulded ones. The thing is what is the point of using an amazing (and expencive) analogue synth and using crappy cables? 100 quids worth of cables at least makes me feel confident I have done everything to ensure the fidelity of my signal.

I really really hate soldering but do it for love! [/img]