well... on the OS2.01T
i don't see any difference between "EGR Auto" and "EGR OFF"
when "EGR Auto" is set i can't program the EG...
how this upgrade is supposed to work ?
thanks
hk
OS2.01 Tribute
Yes, and EGR Auto really helps a bit.
Just try Preset 21 of the new OS (Phattysign), one of those basses with low cutoff, and turn the cutoff (or turn any other knob) a bit up and down
- with EGR ON you hear the sizzle all the time while tuning the knob.
- with EGR Auto it sounds like the length of the sizzle is reduced to short value changes.
It's no perfect solution, but it helps those, who got no DG408 chips replacing the older ones (everbody outside USA not shipping his LP to USA and back) and still want the other upgrades (midi LFO sync, Arpeggiator etc.).
Just try Preset 21 of the new OS (Phattysign), one of those basses with low cutoff, and turn the cutoff (or turn any other knob) a bit up and down
- with EGR ON you hear the sizzle all the time while tuning the knob.
- with EGR Auto it sounds like the length of the sizzle is reduced to short value changes.
It's no perfect solution, but it helps those, who got no DG408 chips replacing the older ones (everbody outside USA not shipping his LP to USA and back) and still want the other upgrades (midi LFO sync, Arpeggiator etc.).
Did you mean the scanning noise is produced by the old DG408? But they're replacing these with the better signal noise ratio ones when installing the upgrade kit, aren't they? I'm a bit confused and just wanna get ride of this noise. Can you explain this better? I'm outside the USA.jimknopf wrote: It's no perfect solution, but it helps those, who got no DG408 chips replacing the older ones (everbody outside USA not shipping his LP to USA and back) and still want the other upgrades (midi LFO sync, Arpeggiator etc.).
Thanks, David.
I'm not sure about the naming of the chips, but the newer chips with the better signal noise ratio are only repaced at Moog in USA, as far as I'm informed. Advanced soldering techniques are needed, which are not available anywhere.
So I received the memory upgrade in Germany, and the new OS 2.01T depending on that, but not the better chips.
I was quite disappointed about that, but I understand the technical soldering problem causing the difference.
So I received the memory upgrade in Germany, and the new OS 2.01T depending on that, but not the better chips.
I was quite disappointed about that, but I understand the technical soldering problem causing the difference.
I think you are wrong on that point, jimhead ...jimknopf wrote:I'm not sure about the naming of the chips, but the newer chips with the better signal noise ratio are only repaced at Moog in USA, as far as I'm informed. Advanced soldering techniques are needed, which are not available anywhere.
(http://www.moogmusic.com/forum/viewtopi ... sc&start=0)
I am promised the upgrade by Fitzpatrick here in Sweden pretty soon. Confirmed by Amos, Fitz and the store.
Amos wrote:We are offering a special factory upgrade deal; if you can send your LPTE to the Moog factory, we will not only upgrade the memory and install OS 2.00, we will also replace the CV sample-and-hold chips in your LP which are the source of the "high frequency intermodulation" noise that some folks have reported in the LP TE noise thread. This results in a cleaner and clearer sound and better signal-to-noise ratio. We'll do all these upgrades, as well as fully test, calibrate and tune your LP Tribute Edition, for the edit: corrected but still decent price of $145 USD.
If you are outside the USA, we can make the chips available at an extremely low price, and work with you to find a qualified technician in your region who can do the upgrades.
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Little Phatty TE #1045 | Etherwave Theremin
Stockholm, Sweden - - - Listen at: assar.se
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Little Phatty TE #1045 | Etherwave Theremin
Stockholm, Sweden - - - Listen at: assar.se
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Well in this case I got the bad end for living in Germany. The German Moog support (EMC, cooperating with Rudi Linhard), told me they were unable to do the chip upgrade with what they have.
Now that I hear it's very well possible in other European countries, my disappointment is rapidly growing again.
Now that I hear it's very well possible in other European countries, my disappointment is rapidly growing again.
Guys, any idea how much shipping could be from west coast?
Little Phatty TE #1023 • Schrittmacher • Walking Stick ribbon • Korg microXL/Electribe MX/KaossPro • Sonnus G2M
MF-101 Filter • MF-102 Ring • MF-103 Phaser • MF-104Z Delay • MF-105 MuRF • MF-107 FreqBox • MF-108M Cluster • Etherwave
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MF-101 Filter • MF-102 Ring • MF-103 Phaser • MF-104Z Delay • MF-105 MuRF • MF-107 FreqBox • MF-108M Cluster • Etherwave
_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/
I just got confirmation from a technician in the Netherlands who can do this work.
It's true that not all technicians can replace the DG408 sample-hold chips, because it's very difficult. However, there is no relation between the noise you get when the EG Matrix is being scanned, and the DG408 chips... they are two different issues. You get the scanning noise the same regardless of which sample-hold chips you have. The only way to use the EG section buttons is to scan them, which makes a noise... so, this Auto mode scans the EG section buttons for the shortest possible time, to make the least possible noise while still allowing the use of the EG buttons. Yes it is a compromise but it's a fairly good one considering the necessary limitations. Don't worry about the DG408 chips in this regard however, there is no difference in the "EG Matrix" scanning noise whether you have the new DG408s or the old ones.
The new DG408s serve only to reduce a much smaller and less obvious form of interference than the EG Matrix... it's something most folks have never heard. Yes it's better to have the new DG408 chips if it's an option, but it's not much better... it's something that one might call (in colloquial English) "the icing on the cake" -- not necessary, just a fine point of improvement.
It's true that not all technicians can replace the DG408 sample-hold chips, because it's very difficult. However, there is no relation between the noise you get when the EG Matrix is being scanned, and the DG408 chips... they are two different issues. You get the scanning noise the same regardless of which sample-hold chips you have. The only way to use the EG section buttons is to scan them, which makes a noise... so, this Auto mode scans the EG section buttons for the shortest possible time, to make the least possible noise while still allowing the use of the EG buttons. Yes it is a compromise but it's a fairly good one considering the necessary limitations. Don't worry about the DG408 chips in this regard however, there is no difference in the "EG Matrix" scanning noise whether you have the new DG408s or the old ones.
The new DG408s serve only to reduce a much smaller and less obvious form of interference than the EG Matrix... it's something most folks have never heard. Yes it's better to have the new DG408 chips if it's an option, but it's not much better... it's something that one might call (in colloquial English) "the icing on the cake" -- not necessary, just a fine point of improvement.
New update!
I just spoke to Rudi Linhard, our Moog tech in Germany.
There has been some confusion here.
Rudi says that he definitely can install the DG-408 chips; he does have the equipment to do this modification, no problem.
This upgrade for JimKnopf was the first Little Phatty Tribute edition which Rudi has upgraded. Rudi asked Jim if there was any noise or problem with the Tribute, and apparently Jim said that the sound was OK, there was not any noise. Rudi did not change out the DG408 chips because the new chips looked just the same as the old ones, and in any case the customer was not hearing any noise problems. So, it seemed there was no need to change these sensitive chips if there was not a problem with them to begin with.
I admit, I was confused also, or I could have clarified the situation.
Now I understand clearly. Here is the full situation regarding LP upgrade service in Germany:
Service is performed by Rudi Linhard, working for EMC. He can update the memory of the Little Phatty and load the new operating system, and he can also replace these DG408 chips. These are really two separate things and should be considered as such (although, of course they can be done at the same time) -- Customers should please specify that they want one or both modifications to be done. The cost of this work is up to EMC to determine; please contact EMC for pricing information.
If you have any questions, please do not hesitate to contact me.
Jim, I am sorry for the original confusion; this is all very new and it took some time to figure it out. Rudi says he can replace the DG408 chips if you want them.
Kind regards,
Amos Gaynes
I just spoke to Rudi Linhard, our Moog tech in Germany.
There has been some confusion here.
Rudi says that he definitely can install the DG-408 chips; he does have the equipment to do this modification, no problem.
This upgrade for JimKnopf was the first Little Phatty Tribute edition which Rudi has upgraded. Rudi asked Jim if there was any noise or problem with the Tribute, and apparently Jim said that the sound was OK, there was not any noise. Rudi did not change out the DG408 chips because the new chips looked just the same as the old ones, and in any case the customer was not hearing any noise problems. So, it seemed there was no need to change these sensitive chips if there was not a problem with them to begin with.
I admit, I was confused also, or I could have clarified the situation.
Now I understand clearly. Here is the full situation regarding LP upgrade service in Germany:
Service is performed by Rudi Linhard, working for EMC. He can update the memory of the Little Phatty and load the new operating system, and he can also replace these DG408 chips. These are really two separate things and should be considered as such (although, of course they can be done at the same time) -- Customers should please specify that they want one or both modifications to be done. The cost of this work is up to EMC to determine; please contact EMC for pricing information.
If you have any questions, please do not hesitate to contact me.
Jim, I am sorry for the original confusion; this is all very new and it took some time to figure it out. Rudi says he can replace the DG408 chips if you want them.
Kind regards,
Amos Gaynes
Sorry to contradict,
but this is definitely NOT how my upgrade went. I had sent in my LP with a written statement added in the package that I wanted the FULL upgrade as mentioned on your internet page! There can't be a bit of doubt about this written request. I can translate it here if you need any further proof.
When I phoned to know when the LP would be sent back to me, Rudi told me that they had NOT put in the new chips and that they saw no way to do so. I was quite irritated and told him that I had expected the full upgrade.
When he heard about my frustration he asked me how heavy the noise problem was and I told him I most times get by with using PRESET sounds, but had the noise problem with certain settings when changing envelope settings during play with low cutoffs (scanner noise). I have NEVER said that "there was not any noise". I can demonstrate the scanner noise while moving the value knob up to now, and with certain sounds it is well audible, even with EGR auto.
In our talk I have definitely NOT been offered to build in the new chips without problems. Why on earth should I send in an LP for doing the upgrade and not wish that implemented????
May I remind you, Amos, of what you youself answered me after I told you about my irritation by email? You answered me
"So, Rudi Linhard is our repair tech in Germany and he is very good, but he does not have the equipment to rework surface-mount electronics and so he did not risk the replacement of the DG408 chips. This is something we can do here, or if you find a technician who is good with surface-mount electronics then you can have these chips replaced yourself at any time."
So the confusion in this case certainly did not come from my side! And I'm the one now sitting here with an incomplete upgrade and having the choice to spend another load of money for sending in the LP a second time, plus then spending a much higher price than USA customers spend for the upgrade or stay with half the upgrade. I'm at a price of 165€ already now (price without new chips built in and another sending forth and back plus work time for doing it all over).
I'm really annoyed now, because with the information told above now (which was NOT the information I got) I would have insisted on getting the new chips anytime! I have a lot of respect for EMC and for Rudi, but this kind of talking this way now and that way then is totally unfair from my view and I'm terribly sour about that!
but this is definitely NOT how my upgrade went. I had sent in my LP with a written statement added in the package that I wanted the FULL upgrade as mentioned on your internet page! There can't be a bit of doubt about this written request. I can translate it here if you need any further proof.
When I phoned to know when the LP would be sent back to me, Rudi told me that they had NOT put in the new chips and that they saw no way to do so. I was quite irritated and told him that I had expected the full upgrade.
When he heard about my frustration he asked me how heavy the noise problem was and I told him I most times get by with using PRESET sounds, but had the noise problem with certain settings when changing envelope settings during play with low cutoffs (scanner noise). I have NEVER said that "there was not any noise". I can demonstrate the scanner noise while moving the value knob up to now, and with certain sounds it is well audible, even with EGR auto.
In our talk I have definitely NOT been offered to build in the new chips without problems. Why on earth should I send in an LP for doing the upgrade and not wish that implemented????
May I remind you, Amos, of what you youself answered me after I told you about my irritation by email? You answered me
"So, Rudi Linhard is our repair tech in Germany and he is very good, but he does not have the equipment to rework surface-mount electronics and so he did not risk the replacement of the DG408 chips. This is something we can do here, or if you find a technician who is good with surface-mount electronics then you can have these chips replaced yourself at any time."
So the confusion in this case certainly did not come from my side! And I'm the one now sitting here with an incomplete upgrade and having the choice to spend another load of money for sending in the LP a second time, plus then spending a much higher price than USA customers spend for the upgrade or stay with half the upgrade. I'm at a price of 165€ already now (price without new chips built in and another sending forth and back plus work time for doing it all over).
I'm really annoyed now, because with the information told above now (which was NOT the information I got) I would have insisted on getting the new chips anytime! I have a lot of respect for EMC and for Rudi, but this kind of talking this way now and that way then is totally unfair from my view and I'm terribly sour about that!