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MiniBrute Pitch Out to Sub Phatty Pitch In

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MiniBrute Pitch Out to Sub Phatty Pitch In

Postby mico » Sat Mar 23, 2013 6:17 pm

I just recently bought a Minibrute for the sole purpose of driving the Sub Phatty's pitch with it. The problem is, however, I am not getting any sound whatsoever from Sub Phatty when pressing Minibrute's keybed. :(

I have a 3.5mm TS to 1/4" TS mating the two CVs but nothing is transpiring from this connection.

Is there something I'm missing because I know the Minibrute runs @ 1v per octave and the Sub Phatty should be at the same standard.

Any help that could possibly be had would be *more* than appreciated. I would seriously adore any assistance in this.

Thanks in advance!
Last edited by mico on Sat Mar 23, 2013 8:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: MiniBrute Pitch Out to Sub Phatty Pitch In

Postby mico » Sat Mar 23, 2013 6:33 pm

The MiniBrute also appears to be stuck in some form of hold mode that is not present on the front panel. It isn't the Arp's 'hold' because the Arp is set to 'off'.

I'm not sure if my unit is defective or what, but I know most you Moogers have either picked up one of these synths yourselves or at least have given a heavy trial.
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Re: MiniBrute Pitch Out to Sub Phatty Pitch In

Postby mico » Sat Mar 23, 2013 7:55 pm

mico wrote:The MiniBrute also appears to be stuck in some form of hold mode that is not present on the front panel. It isn't the Arp's 'hold' because the Arp is set to 'off'.

I'm not sure if my unit is defective or what, but I know most you Moogers have either picked up one of these synths yourselves or at least have given a heavy trial.

Well, okay. The 'hold' was due to the Gate latch on the back being knocked into 'hold' during shipping.

That still does not resolve my greatest concern - that being sending the Pitch CV of the MiniBrute out to Sub Phatty's Pitch CV input.

This is incredibly troublesome and I must figure this out before the weekend is out so I know whether or not I need to send this back to Sweetwater. I'd ideally like to be able to send arpeggiations into the Sub Phatty with the MiniBrute with small hopes of Aftertouch translating through the CV out as well. However, I am not so worried about the latter as I am the former. As of right now, I cannot even trigger a sound on the Sub Phatty, which is most concerning.
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Re: MiniBrute Pitch Out to Sub Phatty Pitch In

Postby modul8tr » Sat Mar 23, 2013 8:03 pm

I believe you need an attenuator. Minibrute outputs 10 volt cv. Moog accepts 5 volt. -5v to +5v.
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Re: MiniBrute Pitch Out to Sub Phatty Pitch In

Postby mico » Sat Mar 23, 2013 8:32 pm

modul8tr wrote:I believe you need an attenuator. Minibrute outputs 10 volt cv. Moog accepts 5 volt. -5v to +5v.

It really outputs a 10v CV? Does the attenuator in the CP-251 have the ability to remedy this?
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Re: MiniBrute Pitch Out to Sub Phatty Pitch In

Postby modul8tr » Sat Mar 23, 2013 8:39 pm

I don't have a CP-251 yet, but its attenuators are there to adjust the strength of control voltage. Can it offset?

Also I beleive the back of the Minibrute has two little adjustment ports where you can adjust the offset with a screwdriver to help with tracking. You'll need to look at your Minibrute manual for that though as I don't have one.

Try -5 on your CP-251 attenuator first.
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Re: MiniBrute Pitch Out to Sub Phatty Pitch In

Postby mico » Sat Mar 23, 2013 8:55 pm

modul8tr wrote:I don't have a CP-251 yet, but its attenuators are there to adjust the strength of control voltage. Can it offset?

Also I beleive the back of the Minibrute has two little adjustment ports where you can adjust the offset with a screwdriver to help with tracking. You'll need to look at your Minibrute manual for that though as I don't have one.

Try -5 on your CP-251 attenuator first.

The CP-251 would happen to be the only Moogerfooger that I do not have, unfortunately. I was hoping that maybe you had one and could tell me if it would remedy this issue. That said, I know it attenuates, but I am not so sure if it offsets or not.

I will give the MiniBrute manual another look-over for information on these adjustment ports. I'd very much like to remedy this issue without having to buy a CP-251 exclusively for this purpose.

I wonder if there are cheaper alternatives out there.

I'm not really familiar with MIDI, but would what I'm trying to do be feasible via DIN or is offsetting the MB's CV voltage my only course of action?
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Re: MiniBrute Pitch Out to Sub Phatty Pitch In

Postby modul8tr » Sat Mar 23, 2013 9:03 pm

I think most people would tell you MIDI is easier. But MIDI doesn't help you when you are trying to interface devices lacking MIDI ports.

I'm still currently learning CV so I am not an authority yet. I think there are cheaper options than the CP-251 for this purpose.

Try sending Voltor07 a pm. I know he's big into CV and generally very helpful.
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Re: MiniBrute Pitch Out to Sub Phatty Pitch In

Postby Amos » Sat Mar 23, 2013 9:08 pm

the mnibrute gate out must also be connected to the sub phatty kb gate jack, you're doing that, correct?

you could also set the phatty amplitude EG Gate source to "on" which will just leave the gate on for drones... but the Phatty should trigger its envelopes in response to the gate CV just fine by default.
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Re: MiniBrute Pitch Out to Sub Phatty Pitch In

Postby modul8tr » Sat Mar 23, 2013 9:17 pm

Hey Amos,

I'm actually considering the pairing for the future. Will the 10v CV from the Minibrute work with the Little Phatty or Sub Phatty for pitch tracking? Is the Sub Phatty 5v?
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Re: MiniBrute Pitch Out to Sub Phatty Pitch In

Postby mico » Sat Mar 23, 2013 9:31 pm

Amos wrote:the mnibrute gate out must also be connected to the sub phatty kb gate jack, you're doing that, correct?

you could also set the phatty amplitude EG Gate source to "on" which will just leave the gate on for drones... but the Phatty should trigger its envelopes in response to the gate CV just fine by default.

Amos,

Thanks for the quick response!

I didn't have the MB's Gate Out plugged into the Sub's KB Gate In initially, but now that I have, I am indeed able to trigger both from the MB. However, a new problem has arisen.

It doesn't seem like the the Sub Phatty is following the MB at all. I have to press a different key on the Sub Phatty in order for that note to be heard when playing on the MB (which is playing its own range properly). The Sub Phatty is merely playing the same note, regardless of what note I am playing on the MiniBrute.

I am also noticing the arpeggiator isn't triggering the any arpeggiator of the Sub Phatty's sound engine. Instead, it merely drones on whatever note I last triggered on the Sub Phatty keybed itself.

Does this have anything to with the voltage difference? I could've sworn that both the MiniBrute and Sub Phatty had the same voltage-per-octave standard.
Last edited by mico on Sat Mar 23, 2013 9:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: MiniBrute Pitch Out to Sub Phatty Pitch In

Postby mico » Sat Mar 23, 2013 9:45 pm

modul8tr wrote:Also I beleive the back of the Minibrute has two little adjustment ports where you can adjust the offset with a screwdriver to help with tracking. You'll need to look at your Minibrute manual for that though as I don't have one.

I also found nothing in regards to these adjustment ports/pots in the manual after browsing through it again. :?
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Re: MiniBrute Pitch Out to Sub Phatty Pitch In

Postby mico » Sat Mar 23, 2013 10:50 pm

Basically, if I can't get the MiniBrute to arpeggiate the Sub Phatty sound engine, the MiniBrute is of very little use in my setup. As it stands now, when I play an arpeggio on the MiniBrute, it sends some odd clicks that are almost hardly audible. What is interesting though, is that the pattern of these clicks change with a Swing adjustment made on the MiniBrute's arpeggiator. For some reason, this gives me a little hope that this could work. Then again that may be as good as it will get.

Amos, if you could lend your expertise to me once more, I would immensely appreciate it. Thanks in advance.
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Re: MiniBrute Pitch Out to Sub Phatty Pitch In

Postby mico » Sun Mar 24, 2013 9:28 am

Blowing up my own thread here, but I also tried MIDI and sure enough, the MiniBrute does not transmit arpeggiation through MIDI connection. Man, is this getting frustrating.

I'm beginning to wonder if I'd better off picking up an Electribe or MicroKorg just for sending arpeggiation via MIDI. -_-
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Re: MiniBrute Pitch Out to Sub Phatty Pitch In

Postby Benjamin AM » Sun Mar 24, 2013 12:21 pm

I don't own either of these synths but this seems to be an easy fix. As far as the two synths not following one another, this is why there is a master tuning knob. If using the Minibrute as a controiler I would suggest using a MIDI connection for communication. Never have played with one, I quickly looked over the manual and noticed this:
"The keyboard’s GATE signal is also available on the Gate Out". This indicates to me that the sequences may not be transmitted via CV, because they do not originate from the press of a key. I would be very suprised if this option was left out of the MIDI transmition. Just remember that these two compact synths have internal options that may also need to be adjusted. For instance, make sure legato is be transmitted. Make sure MIDI clock is being received/ transmited while using MIDI. Also, try usung the Phatty as a controller. Hope this helps. Breathe.
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