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All keys produce same note, pitch wheel not operating

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All keys produce same note, pitch wheel not operating

Postby bbrucato » Sat Feb 05, 2011 8:21 pm

I have a LP that is producing the same not when any key on the keyboard is pressed, and the pitch wheel is not altering the pitch. I have tried an all notes off, and have ensured a proper connection from the keyboard to the brain. The rest of my troubleshooting is just beginning, and I will update as I go, but wanted to get any ideas you all might have first. Next up: using the LP as a module with external MIDI controller to replicate or not to isolate that as a potential problem. Your suggestions would be very helpful.

Info:
Moog Little Phatty Stage 1 with 1.03 OS.
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Re: All keys produce same note, pitch wheel not operating

Postby bbrucato » Sun Feb 06, 2011 5:40 pm

Update: I tried a MIDI controller and the same thing happens. I don't think it's actually triggering a note. What I think is happening is the pressed key opens the gate and the oscillator for the preset sounds. The volume knob even has no effect on this, either for the output or the headphone jack. Also, with the exception of a few settings of the filter, no other changes alter the sound at all. Sometimes the cutoff setting will alter the sound. I think the only change I'm getting from each preset is the wave form of the oscillator, though this cannot be changed on the panel. I have tried different outlets, including a brand new circuit (our house was just rewired professionally last week) that should be perfectly grounded.

This synth belongs to someone locally who bought it 3 years ago from Guitar Center and has been in safe storage for about a year without use. She said the last it was used it worked just fine. She got it out to test it for me when I went to buy it from her and this was the state it was in. She told me to take it to see if I can fix it. I'd like to get this in proper working order. Please help.

Other concern: there seems to be a TON of problems with this unit from scouring this forum, relating to bugs in the software that require frequent hardware debugs, and others relating to poor grounding. I plan to tour with this synth, and cannot rely on proper grounding of circuits at every venue I play. Is there a resolution to this? If this is a problem in every unit, this is certainly a defect that should warrant a recall of all sold units, regardless of warranty status. Perhaps I understand this problem incorrectly and it may be related to a few select units that have been mishandled or damaged, and not a problem (defect) of the design. As far as the debugging is concerned, this may be in the same scenario. I read of someone else on the forum who debugged their unit then had to a couple weeks later. Would I have to tour with a PC and the Silicon Labs debugger just to make sure my synth would work every night? Is the Little Phatty designed to be a studio-only instrument, not suited for the rigors of the road?

Mechanical and software problems that are flawed in the design stage are subject to consumer protections that extend beyond a manufacturer's warranty. It's not even an issue of Moog's stellar reputation, or the determinations of the company on what to warranty. A product sold in the United States that has known defects must be repaired satisfactorily by its manufacturer at their cost, and a company's warranty period does not limit their liability. Failure to comply is subject to investigation and charges from individual state Attorney' General and by the Federal Trade Commission. I don't write this to be a dick or with any threatening intentions. I'm just really surprised to read about people having to deal with so many of their own software and hardware repairs at their own cost, or to have to ship the unit to the manufacturer at their cost and then have to pay for repairs. Defects are defects, plain and simple. The defect occurred in its time of manufacture, so whether the problem arises the day it is purchased or years later, it is the manufacturer's problem. If it happens with certain frequency, it can be assumed that every unit has the underlying potential for the defect. Just like the case of the Toyota gas pedal recall, many of the owners were far beyond their warranty. I own a crib for my daughter that I'm the third owner for; it has defective and dangerous design problems, and I just received replacement parts at no charge to myself, even though I'm not the original owner, it was manufactured 7 years ago, and is far beyond its warranty. Under current business ethics, many companies issue recalls voluntarily before the occurrences reach a rate at which states or the federal government will step in and require it. Additionally, most companies own insurance to cover such costs. I would think that with Moog's reputation, the former would happen, that there would be a voluntary recall. Is there any intention to do anything beyond software patches and actually recall the units to repair the problems relating to grounding and needing debugs?
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Re: All keys produce same note, pitch wheel not operating

Postby Amos » Mon Feb 07, 2011 5:41 pm

Hi there,

The problems you describe with your new-to-you Little Phatty are not indicative of any systemic issue affecting all units.
If the the panel knobs do not alter the sound when you turn them, that sounds like an unusual hardware problem unique to your unit. My first guess might be a loose ribbon cable, or possibly something more central like an a/d or d/a converter is not working.

May I suggest that you simply contact our technical support here at the factory to request an RMA.

Tech Support will review your grounding and make sure it will perform well for you on the road or in questionable situations, and we can load the latest firmware for you while it's here.

Kind regards,

Amos Gaynes
Moog Music Inc.
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Re: All keys produce same note, pitch wheel not operating

Postby bbrucato » Sun Feb 27, 2011 5:01 pm

Here's an update:

I used the Silicon Labs debugger and hex files provided by Moog. For anyone that needs to flash their LP, this is a VERY easy process. I am not usually very capable with really basic software (those lacking GUIs for dummies) or with troubleshooting hardware, but this was a breeze. It didn't fix the problem, though.

Through the process of troubleshooting and attempting a repair at home, Amos, Rosser, and others at Moog were incredibly helpful and attentive. This has improved my initial impression immeasurably. I know that if something goes wrong down the road, that I'll have a timely and helpful response. My LP is set to hit the bench early this week, so I'll post a final update when it's fixed.

Cheers,

Ben
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Re: All keys produce same note, pitch wheel not operating

Postby bbrucato » Sun Mar 24, 2013 12:20 am

The Phatty came back to me with new knobs, new grounding and power adjustments, CV mod done, new operating system, etc. Everything worked great for the several hours (5-10) of use when it came back. It was in storage since then. A few months back, I fired it up and had some dancing dial problems. I've contacted tech support and sent this video weeks back and haven't gotten any response. Maybe some of you can help me. I'd like to get this problem fixed so that I can sell it without feeling guilty to whoever buys it. I need a road-ready, reliable synth, which it seems the LP just simply cannot be.

Here's the video of the new problems. Something happened to this in converting it, and it's slightly sped up and pitched up.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/37304801/Video%20Dec%2009%2C%203%2000%2053%20PM.mov
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