about using extra oscillators

[spin]

hi all!

well, i have some confusion about using extra oscillators and audio ext input of little phatty. An external audio source that go trough lp is processed only by filter...so i can't modulate an external oscillator by little phatty modulation or by the envelopes egr, right?

I am also interested to the slim phatty, not so much for the polyphony (because it need many of this stuff!) but for the chance to add 2 oscillators to the little phatty. But if i send slimphatty output trough littlephatty i can modulate only oscillators of lp; if i send output of lp and sp separately to a mixer (2 mono channel, with midi out of lp to midi in of sp) i probably can't get the same sound becase slimphatty doesn't have overload (so it will work well only with a preset that doesen't use overload) ..right? What kind of setup do you sugget? thanks for any help!

[EMwhite]

External audio is processed by the LFO if dest is filter or S+H->Filter, but wave, pitch, OSC2 all pertain to the internal OSCs that are prior to Filter and not in signal path of ext audio.

But yes, the EGRs (volume and filter) both apply. If you play an external sound from midi (or CV/gate driven VCO if you have CV out mod), then the Phatty's ADSRs will fire at the proper time. If you simply want to play another sound source but use the Phatty's filter or LFO, you'll need to 'fire' the EGRs at the appropriate time either by driving it from an envelope follower (from MF101 or 107) or perhaps from the synth.com audio interface. The other option is to have both of the Phatty's OSC levels set to 0 (no sound), and play your other synth (for instance weak PCM or FM'ish sound source like a Casio) with no 'filter', then trigger the Phatty's ENV with Midi in. The LPs sounds on 0 won't be heard but the envelopes will fire, thus affecting the CZ's sound as pumped through the LP.

The SP indeed has Overload, it's the "OL" button beneath the Filter section/pot. I haven't played one but you can see it in the picture and in the manual.

But you are right the two boxes (SP and LP) are certainly separate entities and there is no way to SYNC the OSCs of all four oscillators (you can come close to matching frequency but they'll be running offset from each other).

Hope I answered some of your questions.

[spin]

External audio is processed by the LFO if dest is filter or S+H->Filter, but wave, pitch, OSC2 all pertain to the internal OSCs that are prior to Filter and not in signal path of ext audio.

But yes, the EGRs (volume and filter) both apply. If you play an external sound from midi (or CV/gate driven VCO if you have CV out mod), then the Phatty's ADSRs will fire at the proper time. If you simply want to play another sound source but use the Phatty's filter or LFO, you'll need to 'fire' the EGRs at the appropriate time either by driving it from an envelope follower (from MF101 or 107) or perhaps from the synth.com audio interface. The other option is to have both of the Phatty's OSC levels set to 0 (no sound), and play your other synth (for instance weak PCM or FM'ish sound source like a Casio) with no 'filter', then trigger the Phatty's ENV with Midi in. The LPs sounds on 0 won't be heard but the envelopes will fire, thus affecting the CZ's sound as pumped through the LP.

The SP indeed has Overload, it's the "OL" button beneath the Filter section/pot. I haven't played one but you can see it in the picture and in the manual.

But you are right the two boxes (SP and LP) are certainly separate entities and there is no way to SYNC the OSCs of all four oscillators (you can come close to matching frequency but they'll be running offset from each other).

Hope I answered some of your questions.

really thanks for your informations!
so probably the best setup to use SP and LP together is to leave them separately on 2 channel of mixer and control SP via midi with LP? what's your opinion?
i don't uderstand a thing...if i make a sound on LP, and i remake it on SP with exactly the same parameters, same modulation, same oscillators etc...will it sound like LP or pretty close or sound different?
and what about program change....if i am midi controlling SP with LP and i change preset with the value knob...will it also change the preset on SP?
thanks in advance

[EMwhite]

really thanks for your informations!
so probably the best setup to use SP and LP together is to leave them separately on 2 channel of mixer and control SP via midi with LP? what's your opinion?
i don't uderstand a thing...if i make a sound on LP, and i remake it on SP with exactly the same parameters, same modulation, same oscillators etc...will it sound like LP or pretty close or sound different?
and what about program change....if i am midi controlling SP with LP and i change preset with the value knob...will it also change the preset on SP?
thanks in advance

If you have the same patch dialed into both *P's, you'll get a stacked note, it will be fatter. There are two settings that will control whether a) program changes are sent/received and b) which midi channel you'll be sending on or receiving from.

If send prg change is on, and your SP is on the channel that you are sending two, then patch #3 selected or you spin the knob to go from 3 to 10, the SP will do the same. Assuming that patches are the same, you'll get a 'doubled' sound. If a different patch, you'll get something other, such as a punch lead sound, possibly combined with a string or pad sound. Using a patch librarian or something free like a SysEx utility, you can use your PC or Mac to setup the patches as you wish.

This is standard Midi, and even without an SP, if you have 'send pgr change' enabled and send on channel '3' for instance, whatever keyboard or device that is listening on channel 3, will also change it's program.

Important that you have a good grip on this otherwise, strange things will begin to happy within your midi setup.

Many of the folks here that have LPs and are getting SPs are doing so they can have Polyphonic (well, 2 note) Phatty action. If set to the same patch, you can play freely and either of the two notes you play will be played arbitrarily across the two devices (SP and LP). If you choose a different patch for one of the devices (such as a bass type patch and a lead type patch) then you'll need to play with a bit more care as the current POLY feature has a 'first note', '2nd note' algorithm that requires one note is held before the 2nd is played and the logic subsequently sends the 2nd note depressed to the next device.

Amos, one of the guys at Moog is working on code that specifically addresses how the POLY mode functions, and how the arpeggiator behaves. (see another thread). It's work in progress but regardless of what is coming, there is tons of functionality in the LP.

[spin]

thank you very much for your precious informations
the are of course several possibilities to use LP and SP together. a simple thing that i would like to do is to add extra oscillators pitched to a differenet octaves to add high or low harmonics in a sound (for example in a strings patch) to create very phat sounds! I thought that this was possible with a freqbox+CVoutputs but maybe with only adding SP it will work better?

[EMwhite]

I'd be interested in seeing/hearing other opinions here but I will again give you mine.

I have a FreqBox and a LowPass Fooger and truthfully, you need the two of them together (and an envelope controlled VCA) to do things right. The SP does all of this and much much more. If you do not have aspirations of having a mini modular (interfacing to Ob SEM, Doepfer Aseries stuff, synth.com, or old Moog gear), then you'll get alot of mileage from the combination of LP+SP. Later on you can always add CV out and get a bunch of foogers. Until then the midi capabilities of the Phatty and the future enhancements of the firmware will keep things interesting for you and at a more economical price.

If, on the other hand, you play guitar or bass and have a requirement for Lowpass filter or Freqbox, then you might find the combination of that with the CV outs is a nice rounding of capabilities and options. But the cost of CV out mod, + the two foggers is a bit more $$ than the SP itself.

Just some more thoughts for you.

[spin]

exactly what i was thinking Well, i'm also waiting for this beast :\
Thank you very much again!