best Moog wah for bass

[franklinstower]

Hello everyone. I am soon to be the new owner of a vintage Vibes bass piano but want to run it through Moog for synth effects. I need Wah which I understand can be accomplished by a filter envelope but also want to be able to put some other cool effects into the bass piano.

I would appreciate any links, suggestions etc. Money is not a concern for me other than I just want to get one unit and not end up with lots of different ones.

Thanks everyone.

[c7sus]

Not sure I understand your question.

Are you looking for analog FX solutions or a digital multi-FX pedal?

I think you are going to have to demo several to see what sounds best with the Vintage Vibe, which looks really awesome BTW!

There are tons of envelope filters available. My experience is limited to an original Mutron III and the Moog MF-101, and they are both cool but operate very differently. Lately I've been looking into 3-Leaf Audio, and Mike Beigal (the guy that designed the Mutron) has just released a new production run of envelope filters too under the label Mu-FX.

If you are looking for a wah-wah pedal Geoffrey Teese (Real McCoy) is the way to go, IMHO. I have an RMC-3 and it is a very versatile wah. The MF-101 will do wah-wah too with an expression pedal.

Other great FX for bass are phasing and chorus, ring mod, and overdrive/fuzz depending on how aggressive a sound you are going for. Compression too. If you want a sound that few other bass players have look into getting a Leslie speaker and Leslie instrument pre-amp. I have yet to hear any pedal or digital modeling that sounds as good as being next to a fully-cranked tube-amped Leslie!

The thing about MoogerFoogers is once you try one you will want more. And some expression pedals, and a CP-251 too, because the CV control is what really takes them above and beyond the capabilities of most of the other stuff out there.

I saw in the other thread you are doing jamband stuff, and it seems to me most of the bassists in that genre don't really use a lot of FX, except when they are really spacing out. I'm a huge GD fan, got on the bus on 2/26/77 at the Swing Auditorium and never got off!

Here is a good demo of some of the Moogers.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8K8YnPqfxyk

[franklinstower]

Not sure I understand your question.

Are you looking for analog FX solutions or a digital multi-FX pedal?

I think you are going to have to demo several to see what sounds best with the Vintage Vibe, which looks really awesome BTW!

There are tons of envelope filters available. My experience is limited to an original Mutron III and the Moog MF-101, and they are both cool but operate very differently. Lately I've been looking into 3-Leaf Audio, and Mike Beigal (the guy that designed the Mutron) has just released a new production run of envelope filters too under the label Mu-FX.

If you are looking for a wah-wah pedal Geoffrey Teese (Real McCoy) is the way to go, IMHO. I have an RMC-3 and it is a very versatile wah. The MF-101 will do wah-wah too with an expression pedal.

Other great FX for bass are phasing and chorus, ring mod, and overdrive/fuzz depending on how aggressive a sound you are going for. Compression too. If you want a sound that few other bass players have look into getting a Leslie speaker and Leslie instrument pre-amp. I have yet to hear any pedal or digital modeling that sounds as good as being next to a fully-cranked tube-amped Leslie!

The thing about MoogerFoogers is once you try one you will want more. And some expression pedals, and a CP-251 too, because the CV control is what really takes them above and beyond the capabilities of most of the other stuff out there.

I saw in the other thread you are doing jamband stuff, and it seems to me most of the bassists in that genre don't really use a lot of FX, except when they are really spacing out. I'm a huge GD fan, got on the bus on 2/26/77 at the Swing Auditorium and never got off!

Here is a good demo of some of the Moogers.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8K8YnPqfxyk

Very cool man. If my question sounded vague its because I don't know much about equipment yet. I am going to take my time getting the right effects and you are right they will be used very little-- just want them to be there when they are needed-- nothing overdone and it all has to be high quality, no shortcuts on the sound. I will definitely look into the Leslie amp and preamp now that you mention it. The vintage vibes bass has a tube pre-amp built into it by the way.

On effects I want only two things really 1- to play high bass that sounds like Jerry in Estimated or Fire and 2- to have one other very psychedelic sounding effect for when we get good and weird.....

The Grateful Dead changed my life back in 1990 and have been ever since-- I continue to learn about life and spirituality from their music. The band I am in is not going to try to reproduce their songs (much) but we want to come from the same place with the music and draw from the same rich musical heritage of traditional and folk- even some Cajun I was exposed to a lot as a kid by my father and some of out own songs I have written. We want it to be music that takes people into a higher level of consciousness. It is entirely possible that none of us alone or together are capable of this but we are going to make a serious attempt at it anyway. The worst that can happen is that we spend a lot of time enjoying playing together but never get that good..... We aren't thinking record deals at all-- just serving the community we live in with sound.

[c7sus]

The Jerry thing on Estimated and Fire is a Mutron Octave Divider into a Mutron III. Not really sure how a Rhodes piano bass into an octave divider would sound. It's really more of a guitar effect, and works best for single-note lines rather than chording. Ebay is getting crazy prices for those old pieces.

Mike Beigal is also doing a new run of Octave Dividers. Mu-fx.com

For all things Dead-gear related (plus tabs and vigorous debate about tabs/gear/best versions of tunes )check out the forums on RUKind.

http://www.rukind.com/

Good luck with your new band. I got turned on to the Dead back in high school and it's been a long strange trip indeed! I'm getting ready for the Phil stream from Terrapin Crossroads tonight! Last night's tribute to 1965 Warlocks/Dead was a very weird show for sure. It's no wonder they got Hunter to write lyrics for them because the early Garcia-penned lyrics were terrible!

[franklinstower]

Let me ask it this way--

What analogue synths can I run an electric mechanical piano through to get effects of any kind?

[c7sus]

I think you are kind of confusing synth audio processing and effects.

You could certainly run a Rhodes piano, or any sound source, through an analog synth, but I think most people would be very disappointed in the result. When you run external instruments through a synthesizer what you get is access to the synth's filter, but without the envelope from the keyboard or an external gate signal that would open and close the filter and create "synthy" type sounds. The gate is held open in order to pass the audio through the filter. If you use an external gate signal while processing audio through a synth filter you can get the kind of stuff Pete Townshend did on Baba O'Reilly and Won't Get Fooled Again or Eminence Front. The Moog MuRF is kind of based around that idea to a certain degree.

If you run a guitar through a sample and hold circuit you can get the rhythm guitar sound on Relay.

There are some "synth" pedals out there, but most of them are really a combination of an envelope filter, ring modulator/octave divider, and maybe a sample & hold circuit.

Check out these links for some examples ideas of effects commonly used with Rhodes pianos.

http://www.fenderrhodes.com/history/effects.html

This is from Eric K., who frequents this site, demonstrating a Rhodes 73 with an MF-107 Freq Box.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9uRne3iz1Vg

And another one from Eric with a Moog Ring Modulator.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLI39olmjwY

[ImNotDedYet]

Congrats on the purchase! Those Vintage Vibes keyboards look really great!

I myself just picked up a Rhodes MK1, and really love sending it through my MF-108M. (ClusterFlux - chorus/flange) Even the lower register sounds nice with it, and since you're interested in sending the higher notes from your bass synth for effects processing, you could get some really nice sounds with ClusterFlux, not to mention if you add on a CP-251, you could get that farout kinda stuff.

I'm not too fond of sending the Rhodes through another synth for filtering...why change the tone of something whose tone I already love?

Also, not sure what kind of output the Vintage Vibes keys have - I'm guessing it's a straight line out, but I know for my Rhodes I need a DI box, even going into my fooger in order to up the signal without adding a boat load of noise. Even if it does put out line-level already, it's nice being able to EQ before hitting up the ClusterFlux. I haven't even tried my 104 on it yet, but I'm sure that could provide some really nice sounds as well, and obviously, it's always nice to go into the 104 for delay, but send the main out to the ClusterFlux for a chorus/flange on the fundamental and then having the 104's delay. And now you can see how these are crack habits...

[EricK]

Crybaby 535q is what I use for Wah whether it be on a clavinet, Rhodes, Bass guitar or guitar. Can't really go wrong there.

[Ledbetter]

I use a CryBaby as well and am very happy with it. The one I have has the Italian electronics and works as a volume pedal when the wah is off. My other effects are: EHX Stereo tremolo, TC Helicon reverb, TC Helicon modulator (phaser, flanger, chorus) BBE Varicomp compressor, and an on-board preamp.

[franklinstower]

Thanks everyone for the replies. I had forgotten about this thread and just found it already open on my old laptop.

I have since found the wonderful world of synth guitar pedals and am very happy with all of the different choices that I have available to me. No one get mad but electroharmonix is looking as good to me as Moog (for totally diff reasons) and I will end up with a combo of both. I am for sure getting the Ravi Sitar from them== holy crap it sounds amazing. Check out this perfectly subtle and very powerful use of this pedal

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_UQqu7UXiU